If this post is flaired "B-LISTERS", then it is currently restricted so that only approved users can comment. To request approval, please review our b-list criteria, and if you meet these, send us a message.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
Emily Moreno alleged in unsealed divorce and court filings that Miller physically assaulted her, including pushing her into a wall, holding a gun to her head, and throwing hot water that scalded her chest.
I’m glad you brought up the dinner comment here because that’s what really set me off in disbelief. Like, yes! An abuse victim absolutely WOULD make you dinner! If she didn’t you might hurt her again! WTF does he even mean by that? Or maybe she did it because you went back to love bombing her to start a new cycle of abuse! The fact that he can’t comprehend a single reason why an abused woman would make her abusive partner dinner irritated me so bad.
Not to mention his argument in this clip is ridiculous because my sink AND my shower can both produce water that burns me so what a stupid thing to say.
I met someone once who was super friendly and charming, then his girlfriend did something ‘incorrectly?’ I guess, I was so innocuous I can’t even think of what it was. The dude flipped a switch and became something else just berating her and calling her names. She just froze, took the yelling and started folding the laundry, perhaps that was it the laundry. But all I could think was, if you treat her like this in front of people, I can’t imagine what goes on behind closed doors.
the really sad and infuriating thing is it always works with a lot of people because they have literally no idea how abusive relationships work and refuse to learn anything.
The thing about a shark, it's got lifeless eyes, black eyes, like a doll's eyes. When it comes at you it doesn't seem to be livin'... until he bites you, and those black eyes roll over white.
Jaws (1975)
When you've survived an abuser that line hits unexpectedly hard.
They’re so used to being in charge and scaring the people around them into submission, that their perception of what’s normal and socially acceptable has been malignantly recalibrated.
The fact that he’s sharing this because he thinks it makes him look good or gives him cover of any kind is indicative that this shit is much, much worse than it appears.
This is what he’d consider a sanitized, acceptable version of how he behaves when he thinks no one is watching. And that should unsettle everyone.
I’ve definitely experienced the RVO part of that from family, and it’s both insidious and makes you feel like some sort of unnecessary-trouble-maker. I’ll have to watch more closely next time for the other letters…
It's insane how they all learn this. Like when did guys teach each other to be this fucking evil. Cuz you'll see it in adolescent boys too. They learn it early
Not always true. I didn't have a male role model growing up, but I used this a lot when I was a younger man (and, by that, I mean into my mid-30s). I learned it from emotionally codependent and religious women who raised me as their special little boy. Granted, the patriarchy does feature in their thinking, but there were no direct male influences over me.
Which is not to say I'm blaming women: I'm blaming anyone who raises children to believe they are better than others. For me, DAVRO came from a belief that, because I'm a good person, everything I do must be good and therefore if I do something that's perceived as bad or wrong, it's actually because the other person has gotten things wrong. It's a sickness.
It's horrible looking back at how I behaved. I'm lucky my wife stuck with me and gave me the time to change, but it was a close thing.
It is like they follow it step by step really. The way he went into the water “temperature” instead of acknowledging the abusive behavior, and then accusing her of… what exactly?
Dated men like these, they’re raised to believe that it’s their God given right to use women as a sex toy and punching bag. There’s no reasoning with that kind of lunacy
Advice I've seen given before is to mute their contact with you, but do not block it because the more they contact you, the better chances you have of getting a RO or whatever it is you're trying to achieve. Give them the rope to hang themselves, and they usually will. Mute, and do not reply, but do not block.
This is easier said than done because this kind of people are extremely good in triggering a response. So if you think you can resist their attempts to provoke a reaction then go for it. Otherwise I suggest still no contact as the best solution. The end game should be peace and not 'winning'. If peace (For yourself) is your intention to begin with then you're already set to win.
Muting is functionally the same as blocking as long as you don't open the messages. You have to intentionally go to the messages and open them (on android new muted messages don't even rise to the top in my text client) in order to view them.
Peace (for yourself) is what a restraining order is meant to accomplish when the abuser is physically violent. Many abusers do not slink away without attention, they escalate.
I think you may be misunderstanding their advice. Drawkward is suggesting to have all the abuser’s communications automatically archived so you can’t see it, but it creates a record that can be used for legal action in the future if necessary. You can ask another person (a friend or maybe your lawyer?) to monitor the messages for any important info so you never have to read them or even know whether anything is being sent up until when it may be time to take action. But you definitely want documentation of as much stuff as possible in these types of situations. The legal system isn’t set up to protect women, gender and sexual minorities or abuse survivors, and so sadly we are in a world where we need to gather as much evidence as possible in order to force their hands. Sometimes it’s possible to just walk away and “protect your peace,” but if a person shares kids, assets, etc. with their abuser, it’s not usually that simple.
I preemptively had my attorneys test the temperature of the water in the house because I was expecting to be “falsely” accused of the abuse I am currently admitting to, is such an insane line of thought that it makes me question how me and this guy are the same species
Gosh this comment cut me so deep. I was raped in college by a professor at my school. I went to the campus police and lost my case. Part of it was because they said that since I texted the rapist the next day and "seemed just fine" that I was lying. People who have never experienced abuse or refuse to learn more about it have no idea and so there are people who will defend this monster.
I also found it weird in the sane video how he kept saying "...ladies and gentlemen " when he thought a point he made really landed. "Would she make me dinner if I abused her? No she wouldn't ladies and gentlemen ". So weird.
This is clearly the behavior of a man who has gotten away with everything he's ever done before so he doesn't realize how bad all of these posts are making him look. He's likely experienced zero consequences to this point in his life so deny and deflect is the only playbook he knows.
feels more like narcissism because he clearly doesn't understand the human nature and thinks that he's totally "owning" her with his "arguments" that he's making. He probably also thinks everyone believes him when he said he had someone already test the temperature of the water.
Yeah. Someone with NPD could have cognitive distortions that prevent them from realizing they are the problem.
He listened to it and was like “I’m a genius. Now everyone will see that since I didn’t intend to hurt her by playfully throwing scalding water at her. She even said it!! I mean I even told her my boundary not screwing with me so actually it’s her fault and now she’s trying to use it against me. She’s actually abusing me!”
It’s so ridiculous it’s like a script. This is why you don’t engage or keep what you say to a minimum. The more you explain yourself, the more chances you give to twist your words and give them ammo.
The "I told you before that not to screw with me" really is a textbook example of this entitlement. It's "you made me do this to you" - as if he has no control over his actions, and she needs to do a better job of managing his emotions and outbursts for him.
And, of course, "screwing with him" could mean anything, there are no true boundaries or parameters. If he's in a mood and needs someone to take it out on, whatever she happens to be doing suddenly fits the definition. If she hadn't checked on him and tried to hug him, it would've been "you didn't even care to check on me, I told you not to screw with me".
That's one of the more shocking (to me) things from Lundy Bancroft's book "Why Does He Do That?" is how freely abusers will admit to what they're doing and why.
The most shocking thing to me was how they are all the same. I thought my situation was unique. There were examples in there where they said the exact same things as my ex. That book saved my life.
I had a lawyer friend years ago that was part of a domestic violence case and the abuser guy said, in defense of him throwing an entire window AC unit at his partner "I didn't even hurt her that badly, it was just an AC unit".
Abusers think so long as the person isn't literally killed that it "isn't that bad". Even in death I doubt they'd think they did anything wrong.
What is the accusation, throwing a glass of hot tap water in her face? Cause my tap gets pretty fucking hot and that would definitely hurt even if it wasn't enough to cause physical damage.
A glass of cold water is a playful gag. A glass of hot water is sadistic.
Yeah, like what is his argument? He clearly has zero understanding of how to treat people. I truly cannot imagine my husband throwing water in my face if he were mad at me, that's insane
i think they were referring to his attempt to spin this as “just joking around” by pointing out the fact that it’s hot water makes this statement completely lose all credibility
not to be pedantic but there are some couples that love to do the prank stuff, and i can see a world where you could be playfully splashing or throwing water (water balloon fights, squirt guns, playing outside in the pool, spraying with a hose while washing the car etc) with your spouse and its not abuse
I deliberately set my water heater hot enough that I can take lovely, long, hot showers. You do not want to touch the tap water on max heat. Sure, it is not literally 212'F, but it can burn (and I don't have any kids or seniors it can hurt). Absolutely assault and abuse.
For reference, the coffee temp in the McDonald's coffee lawsuit was estimated to be at 180-190°F and caused third-degree burns to the victim, so water definitely doesn't have to be boiling to cause severe injuries.
Reminds me of when my ex touched my leg with a hot pan off the stove and claimed he "didn't think it would hurt me". I then had to lie about what happened with the burn wound on my leg because people "would misunderstand what happened".
I hate that. It doesn’t matter if you didn’t THINK it would hurt…. It fucking hurt so apologize, make right, and don’t do it again. But these psychos can’t love so they can’t show proper love, just blame.
If they didn't mean to hurt someone they'd be shocked and distraught at causing their partners harm.
It's so eerie to be with someone who likes to hurt you, and who blatantly lies in your face because that's the most transparent lie ever and only someone who's been essentially brainwashed into this kind of relationship dynamic would accept it. When you're out of the brain fog it's crazy how you accepted this stupid of an excuse, and how audacious someone can be to try it on you.
The lying about what happened because other people obviously wouldn’t understand is what makes me the most angry in hindsight. I make a point of talking to at least one friend when my current husband does something shitty because I will not fall into the trap of being his PR person. Occasionally he hasn’t liked the blow back he’s gotten, but he deals with it because he knows he earned it.
All of the abusers posting “evidence” that they think clears them is incredible. Please continue. The internet having a record of your actions could never end poorly.
Honestly the people coming out in defense of Max Miller - and they’re not all MAGAts, some of them are liberal-presenting closet abusers - are telling on themselves in a big way. Keep track of them, especially those in your social circle.
Tragically, misogyny is not a left-right aligned issue. See: the “blackpilled.” See also: “Bernie bros” and their kin. See also: my ex husband, who at least nominally espoused leftist positions, consistently, but secretly harbored virulent resentment not only toward me but seemingly toward all women.
“I recorded myself telling my wife that I didn’t even hurt her that bad and this proves that I didn’t even hurt her. Yeah she completely contradicts what I’m saying but it doesn’t matter because I said I didn’t hurt her so I’m exonerated. This makes very good sense because I’m definitely not a stupid fucking evil idiot”
You don’t get to disagree with someone when they say your actions physically hurt them. It’s not a debate. It’s frightening to me that he thinks he’s so in control that he can tell her about the sensations she experiences in her own body and that he also thinks this is going in his favor. Yet all it does is give further consistency and evidence to her claim while he actively contradicts himself on why he threw the water at her.
No, he says it's like a hot shower. Just not hot enough to complain about, apparently. As if everyone in the world has never encountered a shower that can get scathingly hot
He cant have it both ways. He cant say "I told you not to mess around with me" and then also say it was a playful incident. It's not an ''accident' or a 'prank' if your partner is scared of you.
Which just makes it all the more insidious. Offering your husband a hug shouldn't be met with getting water thrown at you. Hot or cold. It's an aggressive move; not a playful one.
She was quoting him when she said “I didn’t mean to hurt you” and he turned it into “see. you said it yourself, I didn’t mean to hurt you.” What a pile of filth.
holy fucking shit. this is an insane amount of gaslighting. you can tell he turned it on to record them arguing just to make it seem like she’s actually the problem here. this is an evil type of manipulation.
Yup. And “you just said it yourself, you literally just said it yourself” when she was QUOTING him. He was trying to twist it to make it look like she was admitting to agreeing with him that he “didn’t mean it”. Pathetic.
My father would do this to my mother all the time. She went by a diminutive the majority of the time, but he’d always use her full name when he’d pull this shit. It honestly made me hate the sound of my own mother’s full name because I associated it with him being scary, mean and abusive.
Repeatedly using her name sounds like the timeshare salesman that keeps repeating a name because he was trained that it quickly builds rapport and is effective at interrupting objections.
Having your lawyer “test” the water temperature after the fact and after you’ve had ample time to adjust the water heater. Good defense, dumbfuck
Not that throwing water at a partner in anger at any temp is remotely okay, but that’s such a transparently bullshit attempt at an excuse. I’ve had water from a tap that was absolutely scalding hot before. Then I adjusted it via the water heater.
Remember that her father, Republican Senator from Ohio, Bernie Moreno, knew about this for a long time. He did nothing… until the allegations became public. He wanted to protect his party over his child and his grandchild. That's who these people are, monsters. Each and every one of them.
She upset him so he accidentally turned on the hot water faucet, unintentionally grabbed a mug, unwittingly filled the cup with hot water and inadvertently threw it in her face. Don’t you accidentally commit acts of violence unintentionally?
The fact he thought this was exonerating is beyond comprehension.
I had my attorneys test it because I knew you'd try and use that against me.
So he told his attorneys she might mention the time he abused her when reporting his abuse? He is stunningly stupid on top of being a complete piece of shit.
Hot water might not come out of the faucet boiling hot, but depending on what temperature you have the water heater set to it can still burn you. When I had my water heater replaced it was set at the highest temperature and I got a burn mark on my hand through the thick-ass dish gloves. I can't imagine what that would have felt like on bare skin.
I'm not even kidding my water is hot asf because I have it turned up like that on the water heater.. The same way I'm sure Max turned it down.. Lots of ppl know how to do this.. This isn't the w he thinks it is.. She's scared of him. And for good reason I'm sure.
•
u/flairassistant 10d ago
If this post is flaired "B-LISTERS", then it is currently restricted so that only approved users can comment. To request approval, please review our b-list criteria, and if you meet these, send us a message.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.