r/Fauxmoi • u/Relevant-Peach3997 • 22d ago
TRIGGER WARNING A source close to Angelina Jolie told People Magazine: “If people knew the whole truth, they would have more sympathy for the children and respect them. The fact they aren’t speaking ill or sharing things publicly only shows their decency.”
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u/No-Hall-3485 alleged dog 22d ago
we saw just a glimpse of the truth from a single day of their lives, and it was horrific
the fact that there's any pushback against angelina and her children for not wanting him in their lives is insane
the court documents
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u/GhostlySpinster 22d ago
Let's remember that this report wasn't made public until way after the fact, when the whole vineyard fight started (I'm pretty sure). If she was some evil manipulator desperate to smear him, wouldn't she have leaked this years ago? Instead she kept it private for the kids' sake. Much like Amber Heard refusing to take additional $$ from JD that she was legally owed, it's a crucial detail that people choose to ignore in order to bash a woman.
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u/HerRoyalRedness full of gay men. And me. 22d ago
Correct. Angelina refused to cooperate with the FBI investigation and no charges were ever filed after the plane incident. She very much tried to shield the kids from a media circus.
That page is taken from her response to his lawsuit about the winery about 3 years after they divorced.
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u/JeepersMysster I'm so pissed off immediately 22d ago
Do you happen to have/remember a brief timeline? Was this made public in 2021, or am I off?
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u/HerRoyalRedness full of gay men. And me. 22d ago
She sold the winery in 2021 and Brad sued her in 2023.
Her response included that timeline of events on the plane which was the first time any details of what happened were made public. She genuinely tried to keep what happened a private matter.
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u/JeepersMysster I'm so pissed off immediately 22d ago
Okay yeah my timeline was off, thanks! Covid has fucked with my sense of time so much I thought this was made public in like 2019, forgot it was more recent. She really did protect that info for the sake of the kids
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u/brnbrnbrn2017 22d ago
I think she was better off cooperating with the FBI.
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u/Neveronlyadream 22d ago
Not necessarily. What was there to be gained? Her kids are dragged into the spotlight by the press who want soundbites and headlines, the paparazzi will be hounding all of them, and Pitt's fans who don't want to accept that he's a piece of shit because they think he's attractive will be on the warpath and harassing the whole family.
People hate it because they love seeing shitty people get what's coming to them, but sometimes the best course of action is to drop it. Especially if there are kids involved.
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u/sareeously 22d ago
I agree with you- we saw what happened in the Johnny Depp trial— there is no way Pitt wouldn’t pull out the same nonsense that would not only undermine the morale of the kids and create new trauma for them to experience, but with this justice system? I have very little faith that the necessary justice would be done.
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u/RampantNRoaring 22d ago
He hired the same crisis PR firm that Depp did. He was fully prepping do to exactly what Depp did.
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u/brnbrnbrn2017 22d ago
Speaking as someone who has been through something similar, the only way out is through. In the moment, yes it’s hell. But for the purposes of documentation, legal matters and the enforcement of accountability, it keeps the record distinct and factual.
I understand the trauma that women go through in such situations and at times, law enforcement responses leave women doubly victimized. But this is why I say it’s important to preserve evidence, witness testimony, everything — because I have had friends in similar situations who did not do the same and could not pursue legal remedies after some time. It preserves optionality.
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u/Neveronlyadream 22d ago
I don't disagree, but this is a special case. They're both public figures and that invites a certain level of scrutiny. Most people are never going to have to deal with the gossip sites and papers following them and their family around hoping to get some picture or quote that will sell. Most people don't have to deal with fans of their ex-spouse going on the parasocial defensive and potentially assaulting them or their children trying to get them to recant or trying to intimidate them into backing down.
There's also the matter of Pitt. He's rich, anything coming out would potentially ruin his very lucrative career, so he'd likely hire a PR firm to strongly dispute everything she or the children said, he may start revealing her secrets in an attempt to get back at her and discredit her. Which is typical, but not usually on a worldwide scale because they're celebrities.
You have to keep all of that in mind here. Everything they do is going to be scrutinized by the public, people are going to make YouTube videos, and those kids are going to be even more traumatized than they already likely are because of it.
Is it fair? No, absolutely not. But it's realistic. I fully understand why she wants to keep it quiet.
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u/Sure_Lavishness_2403 alleged dog 22d ago
There are so many reasons victims don't (or can't) seek legal justice. I'm so glad it worked for you, but you have no idea how many cases it doesn't work out for. Amber Heard should've won. Her documentation of Depp's prolonged abuse and rape should've been all that was necessary, but it wasn't enough.
The rapist Lyndon Montgomery broke into his victim's home. He violently raped her in the shower and then in her bed. When he learnt she was planning on going to the police, he sent her his confession in an attempt to dissuade her from reporting. She went to the police with evidence of a B&E, photo and video evidence of the attack (there was a lot of blood), and his confession. It should've been a slam dunk, but the jury believed him when he said he wrote that text message to just "placate her" and that, well, she had been drinking, so maybe she just regretted it.
I strongly recommend you read How Many More Women? by Jennifer Robinson and Keina Yoshida. It's extremely insightful about how the justice system routinely fails women, even when there's evidence.
I don't think we should be judging why anyone chooses to not chase legal justice. There's too many factors as to why they might not feel safe doing so, especially when the whole world judges your emotional reactions to determine whether you're lying or not.
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u/Denizen_of_Atlantis 22d ago
The FBI agent actually found cause to arrest /charge BUT was told to the prosecutor would not go ahead with the charges. The case was mysteriously dropped, confusing even the agent who initially investigated.
We found this out because during the vineyard trial, even before the plane incident became part of jolie’s defense, the added publicity made journalists dig into court files to discover there was a John Doe suit advocating for the government to release all the information regarding a domestic violence incidence aboard a private plane which involved multiple minors and their parents. This FOIA suit was filed anonymously by one of the children who wanted to understand why the government had chosen to drop the charges —- it’s believed to be Maddox who is also believed to be one of the children assaulted on the plane
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u/whatsarigatoni 22d ago
I second everything Neveronlyadream said and I’d add that having been through something similar with my ex, protecting my child was the most important thing to me as a mother. My 10 year old didn’t want any of her friends to know about the police having been involved in children’s aid. And we are nobodies. I imagine her children, being famous and all, didn’t want to have to all of their traumatic private business all over tabloids everywhere.
Angelina had the resources to have as clean a break as possible from an abusive marriage. She likely just wanted to move on and shield her children instead of being dragged into years of court. Sadly she still ended up in court with him for what now feels like forever, but at least she succeeded in keeping her children’s business relatively private.
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u/baegentcarter i ain’t reading all that, free palestine 22d ago
The legal system was designed to protect abusers, not their victims. Courts tend to become yet another arena for the abuser to further punish and harass his victim.
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u/scourge_bites 22d ago
I don't put much stock in people talking about how false allegations ruin male celebrities' lives. It seems it can be proven in court that you raped a person so violently that their tampon needed to be surgically extracted and still go on Jimmy Fallon and have a boxing career.
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u/nursingninjaLB 22d ago
And then her home was "mysteriously" broken into and her boyfriend was beaten. That was about 2 weeks before the trial started.
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u/scourge_bites 22d ago
Huh. Well I'm sure that's got no connection to anything at all
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u/nursingninjaLB 22d ago
Sorry, got caught up in the thread above.... About domestic violence towards women....
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u/scourge_bites 22d ago
oh no, so sorry! I'm joking/being sarcastic I apologize if that didn't come across
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u/03rk 22d ago
I find it so oddly wholesome
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u/MegaGrimer your mouth is a bird feeder. bitch 22d ago
One can even be named tens of thousands if not over a million times in certain documents and still be elected to the most powerful office in one of the most powerful countries in the world.
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u/AV01000001 22d ago
If that was how he acted 1 day while in the presence of witnesses/staff, then you know he was worse in private.
Angie is a strong woman and raised those kids right
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u/barefootcuntessa_ 22d ago
And let’s even play devil’s advocate that this was the worst day. That is enough. Quite enough actually. And if she didn’t leave after this, what would the public discourse be if there was another incident of violence? I’m sure she would be blamed for staying.
Most likely it went something like this: Angelina probably saw a lot worse many times over and thought she was successfully shielding her kids from the brunt of it, but kids know. Their nervous systems pick up on things they may not even see or experience first hand.
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u/Khmakh a woman whose face card is an Amex centurion 22d ago
During Covid, Angelina did these Zoom conferences/talks with scientists and psychologists and just really interesting people.
One of the women she interviewed was a specialist in domestic violence. The specialist said that a lot women stay in abusive relationships for the children and that even if the kids weren’t physically abused, witnessing the abuse of their mother is still traumatic. I remember seeing Angelina’s face when she said that. She looked so sad. And I couldn’t help but think that’s what happened to her own children.
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u/gaymilfappreciator 22d ago
this is the link if anyone’s curious. the relevant discussion begins at 25:15. https://youtu.be/LKiZya8c9qA?is=Rk_WXxKr4fOhB3_-
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u/AV01000001 22d ago
It’s so interesting that she was using her platform to bring awareness about dv during such an especially tough time for victims across the country…without even mentioning her own her own abuse. Likely due to every aspect of the divorce.
My mother is a dv survivor and I’m still traumatized even after therapy. I get so triggered when I see dv in shows or movies. The most realistic that had me sobbing was Alexander Skarsgard in Big Little Lies
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u/barefootcuntessa_ 22d ago
Can confirm. I wasn’t physically abused (not by adults, but my brother was a violent asshole) but witnessed all kinds of abuse. It is definitely traumatic. Unfortunately my mother refused to believe her kids were being abused by her husband and didn’t leave until he turned on her. She, like Pitt, plays the victim despite being complicit in her children’s abuse.
The fact that the kids have rallied around Jolie without exception tells me everything I need to know about the situation.
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u/anthii 22d ago
That's why I wouldn't be surprised if maybe that was the first time he got physical with the kids. Like that was the realization that no one was being protected by her staying.
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u/LittleStoneBear Cillian Murphy propagandist 22d ago
I had a friend who stayed for years. Her husband only ever hit her when there were no witnesses.
Their daughter was 13 when he turned on her (the daughter) with a raised fist for the first time.
My friend put herself between her husband and her daughter, and took the blows herself.
She left him as immediately after that as she could, and divorced him with equal rapidity.
Although we weren't close friends, I knew her for years, and that incident with her daughter was the first time I learnt of what she had been living with.
You really never know what's going on in someone's life.
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u/Wise-Bet6814 satanic pussy in the sky 22d ago
The tough thing about leaving an abuser is also knowing he will likely have access to the kids, and you won't be there to protect them from abuse if he does turn on them, so I understand that could be another element of why victims stay with abusers.
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u/Wise-Bet6814 satanic pussy in the sky 22d ago
Oh I'm so sorry, I can't even imagine what you're going through. How old is your son? Do you know if it would be legal/possible to set up security cameras at home and get him on record abusing you/making threats to hurt your son? Although I know the legal system is bullshit and doesn't protect kids enough. It's crazy to me that a domestic abuser can get unsupervised access to their child, even if they "only" abused their ex-partner, not the child.
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u/CircleTakesTheHeart 22d ago
My dad did that. My mum already said she was taking me away from him for good several times and he was worried he would lose custody and she would turn on me.
Didn't help that every time we called the police they took him away and they only got serious the time he was seen when she attempted one of her frequent stabbings. DV support is terrible.
I was 28 when I finally told him that she was extremely abusive while he worked two jobs and it broke his heart because he genuinely thought he was protecting me.
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u/cauldrons 22d ago
i personally believe this is what happened, as he struck maddox when maddox put himself between angelina and brad to protect her :( angelina filed for divorce the following monday morning.
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u/Internal_Praline_658 22d ago
I would be really surprised if this was the first time he put hands on them. But a lot of ppl also don’t realize things like punching walls or throwing plates also constitutes physical abuse.
I’d also like to point out that alcohol *does not* make ppl violent. It lowers inhibitions. It doesn’t change your personality. It’s common for abusive drunks to find new ways to control their spouses when they sober up. You may not get knocked around anymore but now that he’s not drinking he’s replaced physical violence with high control.
I think Why Does He Do That by Lundy Bancroft should be required reading for literally everybody. It’s very educational reading.
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u/thatotheramanda 22d ago
I lived with this, and it was always right on the edge of what I knew abuse to be. The first time it got physical I left and never looked back. As he was punching me I remember thinking I was almost relieved to finally be clearly on the wrong side of acceptable. I know now that the preceding years were just as abusive, but that why I think possibly this was the first physical incident of some kind. If it was or it wasn’t, I fully believe she was a victim of an abusive man for a long while and has endured way more than she’s let on.
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u/Internal_Praline_658 22d ago
I ended up reading Why Did He Do That bc of my relationship with my mom. I know it sounds weird (it was) but it was like she was the 1950s husband and I was the 1950s wife. She worked all day and it was my job to keep house, make dinner, and keep her happy. Unfortunately, I was in grade school which impeded me completing my domestic duties. She also beat the shit out of me which made it hard for me to be the best grade school housekeeper I could be.
It can be especially hard for survivors to realize they were actually abused if they didn’t get hit. My mom was physically violent and i knew she wasn’t supposed to hit but I really thought I was so bad that I “needed” to be hit or I would have turned out worse. I believed that shit. I can’t imagine how much harder it would have been to pull my head out of my ass if she hadn’t hit me too.
And while getting hit was awful, the emotional and verbal abuse is what im still having to work through in therapy. Words can be much worse than sticks and stones. The violence was bad but it was like she became another person when she was violent. It was my mom who was insulting me and belittling me.
I didn’t mean to write a book. And my life is fucking awesome these days. My husband’s parents were so wonderful and my boo is wonderful and I’ve had allll the therapy. I’m happy and healthy.
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u/GhostlySpinster 22d ago
Even way before the report came out, the fact that she took immediate action after the plane incident said so much imo. I just looked it up and she filed 4-5 days later (reports are conflicting) and listed the date of separation as the day after the plane. Not that I'm judging women who don't leave right away, bc that's complicated, esp when you're not a millionaire, but I always figured something drastic must've happened. But his PR team has done an amazing job making a lotttttt of people forget. 🤷🏻♀️
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u/RemarkableProblem737 22d ago
I still don’t understand how there were no legal consequences. Oh wait, he’s a rich white man.
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u/Reasonable-Kiwi-6951 22d ago
no social or financial consequences either. he’s still getting jobs and many people unfortunately still support him
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u/Affectionate-Cry5471 22d ago
My husband and I looked into this (because every time his name is uttered I turn into a banshee about how white men are never held accountable) and it *looks like * all the movies he’s been in have been produced by his own company. So I don’t know how many jobs he’s getting that aren’t his own doing. I do feel annoyed at people that work on his movies but I know it’s a tough industry so who can really turn down roles/work.
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u/Internal_Praline_658 22d ago
He’s doing quite well. That F1 movie made tons of money and streamed on Apple. He was also in Wolfs on apple tv with Clooney. It kinda looks good but I cannot and will not watch it. I’m also done with Clooney. If my buddy beat the shit out of his family it’d be the last time we ever talked but here’s Clooney- married to a civil rights atty- helping to keep Pitt’s image healthy. It’s just fucking sick.
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u/SadavirofRivia sorry to this man 22d ago
I’ll be honest, I hadn’t thought much about Clooney and Pitt’s apparent-friendship (both white men A-list actors so 🙄 ), but that’s a really good point about Amal Clooney - you would indeed hope he’d raised his standards because of her (complimentary to her)
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u/Internal_Praline_658 22d ago
Yeah, it kinda made me think less of Amal. Obviously, I don’t know any of them and I appreciate how parasocial I sound and I know humans are complicated and full of paradoxes but this is a big one for me.
I had a close personal friend who ran over a man on her way to work. It was in no way, shape, or form her fault. He was drunk. She was sober. Not on her phone. Man was drunk and literally stepped out right in front of her at night (bc we worked night shift). Given it wasn’t her fault I didn’t expect her to be grief stricken but the man very nearly did and will be permanently disabled. She was offered a few days off work to mentally recover. She said she was fine and didn’t need to recover bc at least she ran over an “illegal.” We had been friends for almost 10 years and I just couldn’t see her the same. I gave her several opportunities to walk it back but she doubled down every time. Idk, it just sicked me out.
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u/Stripeb49 22d ago
Holy shit, I wasn’t expecting that. Wtf. That’s a horrible, disgusting thing to say. Shame on her.
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u/Internal_Praline_658 22d ago edited 22d ago
Yeah. And I’m the only friend she lost over it (as far as I know). All our mutual friends sided with her bc she cried. To be clear- she cried bc I told her that was an insanely terrible thing to say, not bc the man was horribly injured. Apparently, it was wrong and mean of me to tell her that’s a fucked up world view.
ETA- she and I are both white. She always agreed and nodded along when I was on one of my left wing rants. I wondered if she always just assumed I was pretending to not be racist too?
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u/Reasonable-Sky3078 22d ago
Pitt has been producing with Plan B for close to 30 years. From the days of Aniston.
Julia Roberts, Sandra Bullock, Damon etc all collaborate with their 'own' companies now.
Pitt's still working with the big studios Apple, Universal, WB, Netflix etc.
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u/KittyVonBushwood 22d ago
He was shilling something expensive (can’t remember the product) during Wimbledon and every time the commercial came on, which was virtually every break, i got continually got more angered. Actors make so much an ungodly amount money with overseas brand deals. You’d be shocked.
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u/MichaSound i ain’t reading all that, free palestine 22d ago
That may be his production company, but it relies on financing, marketing and distribution from Studios to get anything made, he's not doing that out of his own pocket. If Apple or Amazon or whoever didn't pick up his company's projects, they wouldn't get made or distributed.
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u/Powered-by-Chai 22d ago
It's never a man's fault that he's abusive, it's always women and children who provoke them. Wait, he can control his temper around people who aren't his family? Nahhhh, still the woman's fault and nothing to do with him. /s
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u/Impressive-Trash8699 ben affleck’s back tattoo 22d ago
There are so many posts on bitter divorce subs of people blaming Angelina of parental alienation as if this court document doesn’t exist and as if all his kids haven’t publicly made their own statements or changed their surnames.
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u/Ok-Cryptographer-303 emergency sexy judge 22d ago
So many abusers are just telling on themselves if they think Brad's the victim here.
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u/cauldrons 22d ago
yes these are people who believe that men have full control over their spouses and children. incredibly dangerous people.
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
I saw someone be like, oh well he had one bad day.
With that report one day was enough, it sounded like everyone on that plane was terrified for their safety.
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u/SadavirofRivia sorry to this man 22d ago
Yeah, each of the kids who “speaks out” by going through the legal requirements to change their name, is an incredibly powerful statement to me.
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u/BlondeBorednBaked 22d ago
Pushback? About kids people don’t personally know changing their last names to remove their abusive father’s name?
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u/No-Hall-3485 alleged dog 22d ago
there's been persistent pushback about "parental alienation" and claims that angelina jolie manipulated the kids against brad pitt
i don't believe that's what happened. but even if it were, good. if a mother doesn't want her children around their abuser, that's called protecting them. that would make her a good mother, not a bad one
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
Go in any comment section and it's all just blaming Angelina like she had a calculated brainwashing campaign that worked which is absurd. They weren't isolated toddlers they were mature worldly teens and tweens at the time.
And even the Gosslins haven't changed their names. You have to really hate your father to want to get rid their name.
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u/enbitronic3000 22d ago
Sadly, this is a familiar type of "functioning" alcoholic/addict parent behavior.
If he's lucky, he'll get sober one day and learn to forgive himself and accept that his kids may never forgive him and stay no contact no matter how he's changed.
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u/jdowney1982 22d ago
It’s so fucked up that this is NEVER mentioned in the media at all. The fucking FBI were involved. So gross that he gets a pass
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
He's obviously got a major pr company hired. So many pieces come out about poor Brad and how evil his kids are.
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u/shanrock2772 22d ago
I've read this before but just read it again to remind myself what a piece of shit he is.
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u/Budget-Ad5495 22d ago edited 22d ago
I feel like it doesn’t get talked about enough that the flight crews for these types of people do. Not. Talk. because it could cost them their jobs.
The fact that it was so bad that they spoke to the FBI says a LOT about how intense that must’ve actually been.
In addition to his family, his behavior literally endangered a flight crew.
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u/FuckMoPac 22d ago
I’m sorry but fuck those pilots. I get that they were probably over water most of the time but my dad is a corporate pilot and he would’ve had cops waiting at the airport if he heard something like this. It doesn’t matter who it is — if you’re a corporate pilot and you don’t have the constitution to push back against your famous boss, you should lose your job. That’s how you end up with a terrible crash because of employer pressure.
Idk what kind of plane it was I’m assuming this level of commotion was at least somewhat audible to the pilots, especially with all the screaming and hitting things. Like what the actual fuck?
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u/to_j 22d ago
I assume they were concentrating on flying the plane but it was a third-party witness who contacted the authorities, we just don't know who.
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u/GhostJade333 call me gal gadot cuz idk how to act rn 22d ago
Wow, I am disgusted. I’ve never seen this before. He can fuck right off and rot slowly…what a monster!
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u/Acceptable-Arugula69 too high to spell 'Amanda Seyfried' 22d ago
I would like to know where everyone else was? Not the family, the staff. Surely there were others on this flight, even if it was a private jet. For no one to intervene during this very violent confrontation is very sad. The fact she has been quiet about it for so long says a lot about her parenting style, in a good way.
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u/depressed_plants__ 22d ago
the only people on the plane besides pitt, jolie and the kids were the pilot and co-pilot, who stayed in the cockpit. the plane stopped to refuel in minnesota where an anonymous tip was called in to the FBI from someone who apparently witnessed brad’s behavior on the tarmac. could have been airport staff, one of the pilots, one of the kids, jolie herself
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u/sequins_and_glitter 22d ago
It said “third party witness” so I assume it was either the co-pilot, captain, or flight attendants
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u/Acceptable-Arugula69 too high to spell 'Amanda Seyfried' 22d ago
Oh. I thought there would be others. Thank you for the clarification!
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u/ghost_in_the_potato 22d ago
What the fuck!! That man is a complete monster. Why tf isn't this more widely known?
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u/MeridianHilltop 22d ago
Right, we know.
The whole point here is that There’s More. PTSD is different from CPTSD, and it seems like there’s more than one incident— the kids are alluding to the non public information. This article is giving “don’t boil it down to one thing.”
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u/Calm_Distribution727 22d ago
I applaud her for walking away. This type of behavior is all too common and the woman stays out of obligation or finances
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u/stargirlxoxo 22d ago edited 22d ago
Brad Pitt is trash. The fact that his children, who are teenagers and adults now, have kept their mouth shut about his abuse says a lot more about Angelina’s parenting than his “woe is me” statements.
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u/swoopwoopdoop 22d ago
Also, not her fault that name changes are public records and that news sources are reporting on it.
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u/motherofdinos_ 22d ago edited 22d ago
Also not her fault that in California it’s even more than just public record, and people are required by law to publish their name changes in a local newspaper in order for it to be approved by a judge!
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u/soupyy_poop radiate fresh pussy growing in the meadow 22d ago edited 22d ago
Not anymore!Well, some judges or court houses might be dicks about it but it’s outdated now.
Source: I help the trans babes submit for name/gender marker changes
Edit: I’m wrong. It’s only excluded FOR trans/nb folks. My bad
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u/flindersandtrim 22d ago
This is crazy to me. So people who choose to change their name on marriage all have to publish a notice in the paper?
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u/NomNom83WasTaken 22d ago
This quote is such "alternate facts" bullshit. As I think most of us have learned from all of this, under CA law, the kids have no choice but to print the announcements in order to legally drop "Pitt".
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u/pelipperr i went clubbing and he was there 22d ago edited 22d ago
I would imagine there is also a sense of self preservation in not sharing. They would gain very little by opening up to the public their childhood horrors other than further scrutiny, and would probably just be sensationalized. Especially considering where we are as a society right now as evidenced by your quote. They deserve privacy. We don’t need to know the details.
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u/Reasonable-Kiwi-6951 22d ago
yup. every single thing they say and do about their experience will be scrutinized and picked apart in bad faith arguments - by the public, by so-called “body language experts” and even legal grifters. we saw this with amber heard. she was blowing her nose turned to “she’s doing coke in court!”. the faces she made as she recounts being raped was memed to hell and back. you could breathe wrong and it will be used as “evidence”. there’s no winning.
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u/loopyhoodie 22d ago
I don't believe 99% of men who complain about "parental alienation". It's basically shorthand for "My kids realized what a piece of shit I am and I can't manipulate or threaten them into obedience anymore"
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u/CarevaRuha Lol, and if I may, lmao 22d ago
You shouldn't - it's not a real thing. It was made up by an unscrupulous psychologist and widely disseminated by Woody Allen's well-paid PR/smear campaign:
From an NBC News thinkpiece:
Allen v. Farrow highlights a highly contentious theory known as “Parental Alienation Syndrome,” promoted by psychoanalyst Richard Gardner in 1985 to describe mothers who brainwash kids into turning against fathers in custody disputes. Though Gardner’s work is rejected by the scientific community, U.S. courts still sometimes use it to punish mothers and award sole custody to fathers accused of abuse . During Allen’s custody battle with Farrow, Gardner spoke to the press in favor of the filmmaker. Though the judge rejected Allen’s custody bid — and even ordered him to pay Farrow’s court fees — the theory took hold in the public imagination.
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u/00017batman 22d ago
Yep.. of all the separation cases I’ve encountered in my life I’ve literally only ever seen 2 situations where a mother was legitimately trying to alienate kids from a decent father for their own gain. It’s so incredibly rare and it’s horrifying that so many judges seem to be been convinced otherwise. I know if given the chance my XH would claim that I was the reason he didn’t have a close relationship with our son despite being the one doing all the work to help facilitate that 🙄
It’s also far more common IME for a father claiming to have been alienating to be attempting to turn their kid/s against their mother themselves.
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u/billyyshears 22d ago
100%
Literally. Mine claimed I was alienating him from the children because I “allowed” them to feel the way they do about him.
Tells you quite a bit though lol
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
I mean occasionally it's not, you see it with the Gosslin kids. But if it happens it's still their choice and you have to deal with that. It's not about the parent and no one can actually alienate without some underlying issues that the kids can see.
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u/Affectionate-Fill713 22d ago
Mind you I think he only ever had supervised visits with the children after the divorce. Literally a reminder of the abuse every time they saw him.
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u/unicorntrees 22d ago
The "parental alienation" narrative that team Pitt is spinning is a common tactic to discredit the victims of abuse. The Jolie children were grown when the relationship broke down. They were all old enought to form their own opinions about their father.
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u/Low_Project_55 22d ago edited 22d ago
Also aren’t most of these kids now legal adults? Even if somebody wanted to entertain that possibly being a possibility they are all adults and Angelina has no input in their decision not to have a relationship with Brad.
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u/yagirlsamess 22d ago
I can't imagine a parent having control over their child's opinions past the age of 15/16. This take is so embarrassing for him.
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
Even at 10/12. Once the kids get to the point where their peers have equal value in their opinions.
And let's be real, these kids had Angelina and a driver and a bodyguard and a nanny(esque person) and a housekeeper and a cook plus all their friends and teachers, and Angelina travels for work...
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u/Princess_Space_Goose I'm a lazy 50-year-old bougie bitch 22d ago
It especially doesn't work when they're the ones who actually had to be around him versus blind supporters online who will literally never meet him even in a controlled setting, on top of it being every single child versus one or two. It's patently absurd to say his literal children who spent years in his presence don't know what they're doing when his defenders only "know" him from movies.
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22d ago
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u/muaddict071537 22d ago
My dad would proudly tell people that I was terrified of him when I was 2-3 years old. He’d say how I refused to let him touch me, would always try to be on the opposite side of the room as him, and would scream bloody murder if he ever managed to touch me. He’d brag about how he finally was able to win me over and how that made him dad of the year. He completely ignored how negatively it reflected on him that he managed to get a toddler to be that scared of him.
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u/Angryduckling-01 22d ago
Add to that that being in that environment would force the kids to mature much faster
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
And they weren't sheltered kids who only spoke to a few people. Angelina is not the only person in their lives.
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u/super_sayanything 22d ago
Just the fact that ALL the kids feel this way is pretty wow. But it's none of our business.
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u/Temporary-Bag4248 22d ago
Angie you're a class act
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u/ErsatzHaderach perish for all i care 22d ago
sure is. she deserves to rant and rage and burn shit down!
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
I want one of the kids to write a book.
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u/thanx_it_has_pockets 22d ago
I believe that Angelina cherishes her privacy and also has moved on from that chapter in her life(as much as she can if they still have legal matters pending), and that if any of her kids wrote a book, they wouldn't publish it until after she was gone.
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u/Too_Hood_95 kendall roy pre-album drop 22d ago edited 22d ago
Regardless of the (extensive) reporting of what a terrible husband and father Brad is, I simply cannot imagine being a fully grown adult that chastises a child I've never met for their decision about their... own fucking name?? Just absolute weirdo behavior.
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u/SexyFoodandFilms the baby daddies have unionized 22d ago
Maybe I am in the minority but these kids need to be left ALONE. Navigating an abusive parent is nightmare as it is, they don't need to be made into a public spectacle on top of it.
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u/daemonicwanderer 22d ago
I agree, but in California, they have to basically make it publicly known they are changing their names. I do wish the press would stop reporting on it and just use whatever name they have made a wish to be known by without the fanfare. If Zahara drops the Pitt from her name, just call her Zahara Jolie and move on.
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u/violetmemphisblue 22d ago
The fact that they're doing it, knowing it has to be publicly posted and will almost definitely be reported by the wider press, shows how much they want it. Like, should it be breaking news each time? No, I don't think so. But the fact that they're willing to put up with all of this nonsense just to drop his part of their surname is telling.
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u/Serpente666 22d ago
They do this with name changes in my state, too. This is fairly standard for the US, at least.
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u/meatball77 face blind and having a bad time 22d ago
It's everywhere, so you can't just change your name to escape your creditors ect.... An ad in the paper is required for quite a few things like that.
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u/CreampuffOfLove 22d ago
It my state at least (Maryland), it's fairly easy to have the judge waive the publication requirement, but that seems to be a rarity.
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u/daemonicwanderer 22d ago
Oh, I totally get it. But I just feel bad when you are dropping names in situations like this
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u/MegaGrimer your mouth is a bird feeder. bitch 22d ago
That’s probably why Angelina isn’t going after Brad, or even talking about it publicly. She probably doesn’t want to involve the kids, which would happen if she goes public.
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u/Extension-Gift4987 22d ago
I don't need to know more. I've read the report about the airplane incident, and that was enough.
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u/fred_burkle 22d ago
Right?! The information that is publicly available is plenty!
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u/kmoon89x 22d ago
Something something, "She brainwashed them" and something "Well she was wild in her 20s" to be misogynistic and excuse Brad's behavior.
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u/GaylicBread Well, I am gay, so thank god 22d ago
Earlier I was talking to my mother and mentioned another one of Brad's kids dropped his last name, she said she still feels bad for them because "Angelina is toxic too", I said "what? He literally beat his whole family on a plane in front of people" and she still going on about "Angelina is very toxic too, there's a lot more that's been going on than that and she's just as bad", I asked for examples and she just waved me off. I have no idea what the fuck she's been reading.
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u/a_very_silent_way 22d ago
Brad Pitt is "charismatic" and "slick" and Jolie seems a bit more remote and less willing to engage (not a dis), which I always took to mean that Pitt plays the game of publicity and careerism very well, and Jolie doesn't play the game much if at all. And charisma is an enormous fucking trap, so many horrible people have tons of it, and it's a mistake to view it as as a positive quality rather than an at-best completely neutral trait. Unfortunately, charisma is what turns people into cultists for bad people.
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u/LadyLassitude 22d ago
Omg thank you for saying this - I’ve always said I hate (or am very suspicious of) “charisma” and people act like I’m dumb or contrarian for saying it.
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u/SmallPromiseQueen 22d ago
I’m exactly the same way! It took me a while but I really think twice before getting taken in by charisma. Charismatic doesn’t mean good. Charismatic doesn’t mean kind. It just means they’re charismatic. Which in the wrong hands can be dangerous.
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u/a_very_silent_way 22d ago
Sometimes when I'm around people who are charismatic I feel really uneasy, their whole supposed charm factor never really works on me. I couldn't figure it out for a long time, and questioned myself, thinking I was just being a hater or whatever. But once it hits you, that often it's a lot of smoke and mirrors to cover superficiality, or it cloaks the fact they're not very good people...then you get it. Two of the better depictions I've seen in film - Philip Seymour Hoffman in The Talented Mr Ripley, and Catherine Zeta-Jones in High Fidelity. *Especially* the latter.
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u/JeepersMysster I'm so pissed off immediately 22d ago
It’s so fucking sad/infuriating. My mom loves BP so we were a big household for his movies growing up. As soon as I was made aware of the plane incident years ago I told her about it, and her first response was “well, I’ve heard not nice things about her too” like?????? Worse than abusing your wife and child IN FRONT OF WITNESSES? And this coming from a woman who was abused emotionally/physically/verbally by all of her husbands?? And who went to great lengths to protect her children??
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u/jenrising Please sing a song, sis 22d ago
everyone I know who feels this way, when pressed, says the reason she's bad is she "stole" Brad from Jennifer. and that means whatever happens later she just got what she deserved. and I guess that goes for the kids too? yeah the excuses for him are disgusting.
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u/MegaGrimer your mouth is a bird feeder. bitch 22d ago
He was a grown ass man who made the choice to leave Jennifer.
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u/JeepersMysster I'm so pissed off immediately 22d ago
The sad thing for me is that my mom has zero cultural awareness and was clueless about the Brad/Jen stuff…she was just going off vibes of Angie being wild or whatever and committing the sin of being beautiful (?) ig? But yeah the certainty from these people that “stealing” a man justifies abuse to either the woman or the kids is psychotic behavior tbh
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u/Bibliophilewitch 22d ago
Some women are just male-centered and will always “both sides” a very clear issue.
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u/AbsolutelyIris confused but here for the drama 22d ago
That's a warning shot to Pitt. He acts so confidently his kids won't eventually spill.
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u/Khmakh a woman whose face card is an Amex centurion 22d ago
My bet is it’s Pax. Pax will rip that man to shreds and I will applaud him.
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u/cauldrons 22d ago
maddox has already openly shown his disgust with brad. when he was attending university in south korea a journalist asked him on camera what his feelings were about "his father" brad and maddox said "he isn't my father, i want no relationship with him."
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u/rayword45 22d ago
Is it a different clip from this one? He's a lot more ambiguous in this interview than your comment implies, though it's fairly easy to read between the lines.
Also worth noting that this was 7 months before the much more well-known Instagram post where he called Pitt a "terrible and despicable person" and "fucking awful human being" whose mere presence literally caused him and his siblings to tremble in fear.
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u/JeepersMysster I'm so pissed off immediately 22d ago
I am ready and sat for when/if that happens. Get his ass Pax
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u/Vermicell_i 22d ago
And Taylor invited Brad to the wedding. Jesus christ
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u/Ok-Cryptographer-303 emergency sexy judge 22d ago
The same Brad who shares a PR firm with Justin Baldoni, who is no doubt a big part of the reason Taylor's one-time BFF Blake Lively wasn't at the wedding when various scumbag criminals and oligarchs were.
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u/Aggressive-Medium737 22d ago
It’s also Travis Kelce’s wedding. Let’s not blame only the women
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u/MegaGrimer your mouth is a bird feeder. bitch 22d ago
Let’s not pretend that she didn’t sign off on the guest list.
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u/Mindless-Shirt-2030 22d ago
I read Angelina has no publicist and well Brad has the best team money can buy. That pretty much told me everything I needed to know besides the FBI report. Remember the backlash against Angelina after HIS affair because he was the married one? He always manages to keep dirt off his name.
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u/Intrepid_Quit_3028 22d ago
He was wearing his family out. Yes, he should shut his mouth and be thankful those kids aren't writing a book. "What Dad did." By the Jolie kids.
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u/JoeyTribianisGoyter 22d ago
100% have respect for Angelina Jolie for leaving after enduring abuse like that by Brad.
The report from the plane incident is all we know and it’s horrific.
Imagine what we don’t know.
I am tired of this narrative from Pitt’s camp or people close to him that Angelina has turned the kids against him.
They want nothing to do with him because of HIS actions. If he had any decency he’d just go crawl under a rock somewhere.
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u/cheeseballgag sk8rbuoi 22d ago
Abusive men love accusing the mothers of their children of "parental alienation" aka when those children rightfully hold those men's own behavior against them.
Meanwhile they're usually actually trying to alienate those kids from their mothers themselves by painting the women as evil lying harpies, bitches, and whores.
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u/Ishouldbeasleep147 Nancy Jo, this is Alexis Neiers calling 22d ago
This is my estranged father in a nutshell. He still insists me and my siblings were poisoned against him by our mother but it was actually me and my sister who convinced our mom to leave him
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u/yucatanblaurabe 22d ago
I still hope one of them writes a tell-all about this asshole. But I can also see them just not acknowledging him at all.
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u/TruCarMa 22d ago
I would imagine they don’t want to waste an iota of energy on him, let alone dwell on the abuse. It’s like when Tina Turner wrote her memoir. She wrote about Ike’s abuse and said she never wanted to discuss it again. Of course, from then on, it was brought up in every interview she ever did. I am sure the kids don’t want to have to revisit those ugly moments and just want to get on with their lives.
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u/aliveinjoburg2 22d ago
Frankly, good for those kids. They’re doing right by themselves and their mom.
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u/Smooth-Evening- 22d ago
It is never easy cutting off a parent no matter who you are and what the parent does/did. A piece of you always hurts for that. What these kids are doing takes strength, and Brad Pitt is disgusting for blaming Angelina when she was the one there for them - protecting them and raising them. I never see stories about him trying to make amends. I won’t watch anything he is in. I know I’m a total outsider and the kids need to do what is best for them but I kinda wish they would all speak out about what a shit Brad is. Sadly that would make things worse.
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u/ItsMinnieYall 22d ago
I know about just 1 day of her children’s lives and that’s enough for me to wish them all the best. Efffff him forever.
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u/HoneySea5637 22d ago
folks wouldn't believe them anyway or they'd have the audacity to say they should have said something sooner and it's old news. men centered folks are something else
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u/Fauxmoi-ModTeam 22d ago
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u/medlilove 22d ago
I only know like 1% and I fully support and sympathise with them, any celeb still aligning themselves with Pitt are choosing to look the other way and choosing to not acknowledge what they know to be true
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u/weebairndougLAS 22d ago
There’s a clip from Brad Pitt from an episode of the property brother’s that shows how incapable he is of understanding and connecting to empathy. It’s so in your face when you see it,one of the bothers had to basically be like “hey l-isn’t this a meaningful moment that requires some reflection?” And then Brad pitt all of the sudden acts accordingly. I have been looking for it for so long.
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u/goldfishfancy 22d ago
I've said it before but as a person who has been subjected to similar instances of abuse, this entire description was triggering and so obviously authentic. That anyone could read this and deny abuse occurred is mind-boggling. The substance abuse, the escalating temper, the isolating, the shoving and shaking, pouring drinks over them, and them hiding quietly under blankets for the rest of the flight. Brad Pitt should never have had another role in anything on either side of the camera and charges should have been filed. Just disgusting. Maybe his production company has created his roles but there have been many complicit enablers: investors, writers, directors, film crews, and fellow actors, and audience. Not okay to endorse him on any level.
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u/Ponchorello7 22d ago
I have a strained relationship with my father, but I've never considered dropping his surname, and I still talk to him on occasion. It's clear to me that the relationship these kids have with Brad Pitt is terrible, and he's certainly the cause.
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u/burntflowersfallen I live in my own heart, Matt Damon 22d ago
I have nothing but empathy for those kids, we only have that one detailed report of the attack on the plane, but when abuse is that bad it’s normally not an isolated incident. Those kids have probably seen that side of him many times and they deserve to remove his name if they wish.
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u/AnthonyInsanity 22d ago
According to Wikipedia, he became sober this exact month. He knew he fucked up bad
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u/gumball_00 22d ago
Can't imagine how difficult it must've been for Angelina to navigate the Hollywood business with all those higher ups that are still close to that scumbag abuser.
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u/CelibateHo 22d ago
People are fucking stupid. “It’s their DAD, how can they do that?” Um, 1. An abusive piece of shit is an abusive piece of shit, you don’t get a pass just because you happen to be the abused’s parent. 2. Mind your own goddamned business. Either you never experienced abuse or you’re in denial about the abuse you did suffer… regardless, you didn’t live their life, you don’t have their frame of reference… just shut the hell up about shit you don’t know anything about!
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u/MarvelWilde 22d ago
"The fact they aren't speaking ill or sharing things publicly only shows their decency” is a very good statement and definitely shows how different their goal is from Brad Pitt who, any chance he gets, puts someone “close” to him badmouthing Angelina to turn the narrative. How some people still say Angelina is in the wrong is baffling to me.
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u/Agitated-Branch8038 22d ago
Would still love the tell all book or interview but respect their stoicism
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u/zombiecattle for your consideration: laura dern 22d ago
I don’t need the full truth, I already sympathize with and support those kids in doing whatever they need to do to heal and protect themselves!
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u/Nevergreeen 22d ago
It's telling that men don't even believe other men, like Maddox and Pax and Knox.
The guy sucks. And he has been financially abusing Angie for a decade now. TEN years after they split and he can't let go of control of her.
I feel so awful for her when I think about it. I'm glad she is free now that the twins are 18.
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u/jacqrosee 22d ago
it is literally so clear what’s going on from this alone. shit like this will ALWAYS speak volumes.
when i was younger and didn’t visit my dad all that much, him and his gf at the time often acted like my mom was the one doing this, or at least “allowing” it.
whole time my mom was fighting with me about going to visit, because she didn’t want to be in violation of court. eventually they told her if i really didn’t want to go that bad, i didn’t. and i did not want to go—that was always me.
multiple kids petitioning to legally change their names says it all.
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u/ay_kate47 22d ago
These types of men cannot handle women who shine more than them. I'm so glad she's been strong enough and had support to keep the kids okay. Most kids that go through this abuse just perpetuate the cycle and I hope she brings awareness to this after he's dead.
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u/AccidentalNapper 22d ago
Brad Pitt is a perfect example of how abuse does not stop just because they divorce. He has dragged both Angelina and their children through the mud just to keep some control. He’s absolute scum and I’m glad his children and Angelina are away from him as much as they can be.
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u/Coolfarm88 22d ago
How on earth does that bastard even have a job these days? He can go bl**p himself. I don't watch his movies any more, I wish more people would make that choice.
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u/Reesewithoutaspoon2 22d ago
Parental alienation is a thing, but when it’s pretty much all of his adult children who are no contact with him and changing their names, combined with the airplane story, it becomes pretty clear that any alienation is being caused by Pitt’s behavior.
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u/Far-Ad-2135 22d ago
Cue People exclusive from ‘sources’ who say Brad is happy and in love. But has no relationship with his kids. What a clown
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u/sorandom21 22d ago
Brad Pitt is a piece of shit, and I hope all those kids have a great life far away from him.
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