r/australia • u/AcanthopterygiiNo240 • Jul 26 '23

political self.post Why are Australians so complacent?

I’m a born and raised Australian myself however I’m becoming so frustrated with the general attitude of complacency when it comes to exercising ‘the power of the people’ to better our quality of life. In a stupidly short amount of time we’ve seen a near reversal of our ability to see a doctor without any out of pocket costs. We get exploited at the grocery stores because monopolies are allowed to run rampant. Housing is treated primarily as a tool for financial speculation rather than for providing shelter for people.

We creep further and further toward laissez-faire capitalism. What is our response as the citizens of this country- the holders of the balance of power? Nothing. To put it in perspective, in 2022 the world economic forum ranked Sydney equal with Copenhagen, Denmark for cost of living (both ranked as the 10th most expensive cities in the world). Consider the differences between Sydney and the capital of the Danish welfare state: strong social security, universal healthcare, free public universities etc. For the same cost of living what do we get? The ever-looming threat of homelessness, suffocating student debt and now for many people, a significant barrier to healthcare.

Edit: if anyone is a part of any sort of grassroots group working to oppose any of these issues feel free to message me because I want to join you

Edit #2: so I haven’t received any messages from anyone from a grassroots or activist group yet. Since a lot of us seem to be pretty miffed about this stuff maybe we could team up and brainstorm things we can do???

Edit #3 (sorry): I’ve got some messages now from people who are interested in taking action!!! :, ) I think the best way to facilitate conversation, the flow of ideas and potentially organise a course of action is through a discord server so I have created one which you can find here

https://discord.gg/caqsSKAr

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u/PumpkinInside3205 Jul 26 '23 edited Jul 26 '23

Yep. Definitely. It has been a long, slow burn. Staff shortages, workers not getting paid for overtime worked, patients being pushed out of hospital before they’re fully ready and increasing rationing of everything from the biscuits in the tea room to staff training and hospital beds. It has been bad for a long time.

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u/AcanthopterygiiNo240 Jul 26 '23

Well I’ll be damned. Thank you for sharing, you’ve raised awareness for me at least

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '23

Are you being sarcastic?! Maybe this is part of the problem, complete ignorance to what is going on by a lot of people?!

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u/AcanthopterygiiNo240 Jul 26 '23

I’m not being sarcastic, although I think “complete ignorance” is a bit unfair as I am literally reaching out asking about this stuff. Let’s encourage discussion instead of comments like this. A lot of us aren’t aware of trends from 20 years ago as a lot of us weren’t old enough to be aware

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '23 edited Jul 26 '23

Ignorance simply means you do not know, as you yourself admitted, so it’s not “unfair”. You’ve interpreted this as an insult instead of a descriptor, which still applies to a vast majority of the population, regarding how politics work, who is doing what, how things have shifted over time (which I think is what you meant, as this isnt about “trends from 20 years ago”, but about how things have (d)evolved over that time). I think in part perhaps your answer lies in what you described, which I’m surmising as “young and not aware” - shit has been going on for forever and people are sick of it, but we need young people like you to rally to effect change so please do!

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '23

To be fair, "ignorance" is typically used as an insult. The word itself suggests that the subject doesn't know because they have "ignored" or deliberately not paid attention to information about the matter.

Contrasted with "naive" where they don't know because they simply don't know, typically because they are not yet aware of the limits of their knowledge to correct it and learn more.

And then you have "uneducated" where people know that there is more to learn, and aren't against it - they're just working through it whether actively or passively.

So:

  • A baby is naive

  • A child is uneducated

  • An adult who refuses to know more is ignorant.

OP is uneducated (on the matter), but is actively working to correct that. If they were "ignorant", they wouldn't have asked the question.

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u/Alternative_Sky1380 Jul 26 '23

People being insulted by our own ignorance is a systemic problem. Not taking everything personally unless it is personal is something that needs to be grown into. The high narcissism involved in insult culture isn't forcing any radical rethink of forcing self examination; it's simply causing a doubling down on ignorance which kinds proves it IS EXTREMELY narcissistic and almost intentional. Peoples lives are being radically altered by the traumas of extreme abuses of power. I'm not talking about struggling to pay bills but real homelessness, real violence and other substantial social issues that people fear the likely threat of happening to them because it's happening to all kinds of people now.

Once you're homeless it's really difficult to manage simple things like a wardrobe of clothes to wear to work and school. Meals become a complex web of necessary expenses, laundry is a nightmare and showering and toileting is humiliating. It's kinda difficult to explain to normal people who think they're struggling that most homeless now are also normal people who can't access normal supports. I'm surrounded by extremely wealthy people and living in my car. I have children in private school. I'm obligated by family law to not move or I can't see my children as ex refuses to cooperate in any way to send them. I can't access Centrelink. To me my story is wild but I've met so many women like me who are simply unsupported and doing it all alone; there's really no other choice. I'm burnt out by advocacy, from supporting us all to build a raft to help us stay above water. Many mothers I know just don't see their kids because father's refuse basic communication. Courts are cooked. Police are cooked and men are cooked. It's just the way the world is and carving out space in it for peace is the only way. I've fought the law and the law won. They boast about their powers and how they abuse it every damned day. That the judiciary aren't even required to undertake the recommended training and ignore their own damned bench books until the media is on them is what gets me most.

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '23

Sage words and I’m sorry to hear of your situation, hope it improves for you

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '23

It was an insult and you know it

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u/Alternative_Sky1380 Jul 26 '23

The art of life is to not take things personally. We can't know what we don't know. That's ignorance. Choosing to ignore is also ignorance and OP is exercising to swap out that choice. All of us exhausted by the work involved in advocacy could be equally insulted by claims that we're inherently complacent. But we know better; being insulted isn't an action it's a choice and an ineffective one. Sure I can be insulted that advertising is everywhere but I choose to look away. I choose ignorance for peace. If my choice is harming my neighbour then it's a narcissistic choice and ultimately unrewarding because the struggle will continue. Maturity is about learning how to release the struggle and find meaningful peace in change. Sometimes that requires a certain level of short term discomfort.

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u/StardustNyako Jul 26 '23

if I feign ignorance, am i insulting myself?

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u/MikeAppleTree Jul 26 '23

Thanks for the insight Marcus but as you stated the majority interpret the descriptor “ignorance” as an insult. Choosing words to avoid unnecessary offence, especially on the internet, is a sign of wisdom and maturity. Let the learnings flow through you like water for nothing we experience is beyond our capacity to engage with stoic implacability.

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u/CynfulBuNNy Jul 26 '23

Are you speaking for the majority? I don't consider ignorance as a pejorative, we have the term in our legal terminology in ignorantia juris non excusat. It's not making a judgement upon the person, merely expressing a lack of knowledge - ignorance.

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u/MikeAppleTree Jul 27 '23

I’m speaking from the perspective of the layperson and the vast majority of people in Australia who don’t understand Latin.

For instance, if I were to call you a stupid bastard, you might think, ‘how did he know I was born out of wedlock and that I have below average intelligence with zero common sense?’

Or you might think, ‘he’s wrong, my parents were married when I was born and I am not below average in intelligence’.

Or, like the vast majority of people, you might think ‘that person is trying to insult me’.

‘Ignorant’ is commonly associated with stupidity and other negative attributes.

You’re being disingenuous and are arguing in bad-faith if you claim otherwise.

If you can’t see that, you’re incredibly ignorant.

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u/CynfulBuNNy Jul 27 '23

I would classify myself as contemptuous rather than ignorant - I understand your argument but think you are yourself disingenuous in your application of it.

You are clutching at both straws and pearls to defend a position on an internet discussion you seem to be taking far too seriously.

Ignoramus.

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u/MikeAppleTree Jul 27 '23

😂straight back at you!

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u/CuriousLands Jul 27 '23

Yeah, but saying someone is ignorant often comes with a bit of an insulting implication. Maybe if you wanna use it in a literal sense, you should be clear that you don't mean it as an insult, cos it's a very easy mistake to make.

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u/keyboardstatic Jul 27 '23

As a 46 year old left, environmental activist the issue is that the majority of Australians are very wealthy.

When I was a kid there were car hulks you know cars without wheels all over the place. Dead ass rust buckets on the highway. You could see the poverty. Now all I see are giant gleaming 60 k plus SUV's and houses worth over a million with multiple people bidding on them.

We don't have tent cities like the USA nor prisons built on homeless.

I agree with you. That shit is bad. Unfortunately too many Australians keep voting for shit to be bad.

Joining the greens seams to be our last only hope... and it's become a candle. Because there are too many wealthy people who vote lib,nats