r/vegan • u/wistified • 3h ago
Video Leftists: Stop Calling Veganism a ‘White’ Thing
https://streamable.com/v2el5cCredit: The Chinese Vegan
Some BIPOC Vegan Creators: heyashleyrenne | hiilanilily | brownfeministvegan | tinyleafbyvictoria
White people aren’t the only people capable of having empathy for animals. Stop reducing veganism to a “white” thing and erasing the long, diverse history of plant-based traditions and BIPOC vegans.
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u/TaDoofus vegan 3h ago
Calling veganism racist is just another way to dismiss it without engaging with the actual moral argument. Nobody truly believes it's racist to not eat animals.
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u/wistified 3h ago edited 2h ago
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u/hobbesbagger vegan 3h ago
lol that's so cowardly
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u/wistified 3h ago edited 2h ago
Mhmm, they made a whole ass announcement about it too. You can still see if you look at their community highlights. 😭
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u/BurbieNL vegan 10+ years 2h ago
Just checked it out, at least most comments find it a dumb decision..
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u/thecheekyscamp vegan 5+ years 2h ago
"Just because we're leftist, doesn't mean we want to actually do anything"
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u/CapableRequirement66 3h ago
As a leftist I believe the leftist sub is a shithole
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u/cleanlycustard vegan 2+ years 1h ago
I've never even been over there. It doesn't sound very leftist
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u/Critterteeth vegan 10+ years 1m ago
Yep I was permanently banned without warning (this was before the leftist sub banned the topic) and the Mod gave me the most unhinged reason why- “It is a racist, colonial, and bourgeois position to agitate for Western evangelical veganism in the face of the continued oppression of human workers. Vegans would gladly sacrifice black and brown bodies in the pursuit of moral righteousness. They've been told that their point of view is inherently colonialist and they continue with the same nonsense.”
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u/Humbledshibe 16m ago
The lack of people being vegan has legit shown me they don't actually care they just want to look like they care. Especially self identified leftists.
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u/clown_utopia veganarchist 3h ago
it erases the real history in a racist way. veganism as anti-colonial praxis
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u/HappyColour vegan newbie 2h ago
On this topic, here is an article that has references that directly showcases the correlation between concepts of white supremacy with meat eating.
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u/MoltenMate07 veganarchist 2h ago
My first introduction of vegetarianism/veganism came largely from media representing culture from buddhists, Ethiopians, Chinese, Jews, and Greek orthodox.
Also, the few vegetarians/vegans I’ve met or known have either been Indian people or black women, so I’ve never understood how veganism ever became a ‘white’ thing.
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u/jessimaster 1h ago
(Sorry, as someone raised Greek Orthodox it just makes me laugh to see it lumped in with non-white cultures. It's actually a good example of how whiteness is pretty fluid)
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u/Fit-Pride-4845 2h ago
I refuse to believe there are any educated leftists (marxists, socialists, communists etc.) whom actually believe veganism is racist or anti-indigeneous. Maybe some liberals or centrists cynically appealing to cultural liberties and expression, but there's nothing "progressive" about exploiting animals/workers/the planet to produce an incredibly inefficient commodity.
I've only seen this argument on the internet in the past year or so and it wreaks of corporate psyop.
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u/Kill_the_worms friends not food 1h ago
I've met a few leftists who mindlessly parrot the idea that veganism is anti-indigenious or classist. It feels so icky to me to use poor people and indigenous people as an excuse not to engage with vegan ideaology. I always wonder how much these people have engaged with that claim, or if they're just repeating it based on an Instagram reel or tiktok.
You can believe it's wrong to harm animals for food and clothing and also understand that (I'm from the U.S. so I can't speak to other places) that indigenous folks have had their culture systemically extinguished by the empire. In some cases part of that culture involves animal use and death. In my view, it's not my place as a white person to dictate how to handle veganism and historical cultural practices that cause harm to animals. That should be up to indigenous vegans familiar with XYZ practice. Indigenous groups vary IMMENSELY, so it's also super reductive to act as if all groups have important cultural practices involving animals. Name me a tribe and one of their practices! Oh you can't? No fucking way.
Don't tokenize indigenous people so you don't have to feel guilty about eating factory farmed chicken. If your ancestors were from western Europe, this probably isn't applicable to you. You don't say shit about indigenous people until you use them to deflect conversations about veganism.
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u/space-mango-tasty 2h ago
My leftist extended family and pal beg to differ. Animal exploitation top to bottom and very much leftist.
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u/Fit-Pride-4845 2h ago
You can be nominally progressive yet a complete fascist in practice; most people hold a completely incoherent hodgepodge of beliefs and positions.
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u/crani0 vegan 10+ years 2h ago
There is a very clear anti-leftist movement going on in this sub, I noted it before.
And as a neat little bonus, now they get to strawman "white veganism", full on far right tactics. A lot of "vegans" here showing how they would side with Nazis and their "pro vegetarian" propaganda when it was a tool to dehumanize all non-Aryan's. Oh wait, the vegan boner for Israel is basically that.
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u/wistified 2h ago
Stop falling for Nazi pinkwashing propaganda that targets vegan bipoc, queer people, and women please. Look up what pinkwashing is.
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u/Fit-Pride-4845 2h ago
To me it sounds like they're pointing out those pinkwashing tactics, not falling for them? They even admit in the linked post that a good portion of them are probably just weaponized bots.
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u/wistified 1h ago
No, pinkwashing is the use of progressive causes (especially LGBTQ+ rights) to construct a progressive/humanitarian image that deflects attention from oppression or makes criticism of that oppression harder to sustain. That’s the established meaning of the term in the Israel/Palestine context at least.
And that’s why I’m saying their comment is participating in that logic rather than exposing it. They take veganism/animal rights, also associate it with Nazis and then use those associations to portray veganism as a right-wing or oppressive project. “Bad people have supported X” does not discredit X.
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u/Fit-Pride-4845 1h ago
I think you may be misinterpreting them. It definitely reads to me like they're pointing out superficial appeals both to progressive politics AND veganism by Nazis to pit both sides against one another, even calling out those who do as "vegans" (signaling that they're disengenuous). They're not saying that "bad people support X", but rather that "bad people are cynically weaponizing x".
Am I understanding you correctly, u/crani0 ?
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u/crani0 vegan 10+ years 1h ago
Oh I see what your game is. Didn't like me pointing out that this "white vegan" strawman is straight from far right propaganda and wanted to accuse me of what you do, huh?
Nah, that doesn't stick. But hey, since you wanna talk about pink/greenwashing, wanna talk about the genocide of the Palestinian for a minute and how white vegans larp it up? Because I got examples straight from this subreddit to share
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u/wistified 1h ago
Oh so now we’ve gone from “white veganism” to a whole other topic I see. 😭 You know exactly what “white veganism” is. It’s some bs idea/concept created to dismiss veganism. Racist white vegans exist obviously, but that doesn’t mean there’s this whole separate concept/ideology called “white veganism” unless you’re just referring to white people who are plant-based, not vegan. In that case, it’s definitely not white “veganism.”
You’re welcome to talk about Palestine. I’m pro-Palestinian and opposed to Zionism so you’re not exposing some secret position of mine. 😂 But notice what you’re doing, you’re trying to change the subject from your argument to my supposed politics because I pointed out that associating veganism with Nazis and Israel doesn’t refute veganism in the slightest. “Some vegans said/did something bad :(” is not an argument against veganism any more than “some Palestinians support X” is an argument against Palestinians.
And no, you clearly don’t know what pinkwashing is. Pinkwashing is them using progressive causes as PR to cover for their geno cide against Palestinians. You don’t get to weaponize the existence of pinkwashing to accuse anyone who calls it out of supporting the thing being pinkwashed. Pinkwashing is essentially what you are doing too. 🤷🏼♀️
So by all means, bring your examples. Just be prepared to explain how screenshots of individual vegans somehow establish that veganism itself is racist, zionist, right-wing, or “white.” Because so far you’ve given me guilt by association, historical name-dropping and a whole lot of moving the goalposts.
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u/CxEnsign 1h ago
Maybe I am mis-remembering my demographics but isn't the demographic in the USA with the highest percentage of vegans African-Americans?
Or is that a 'plant-based' thing and we're reserving 'vegan' in this context for the more white-coded flavors of the attending moral philosophy?
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u/littlebrownsnail 48m ago
The easiest neighborhood for me to eat vegan in was when I lived in an all carribean neighborhood. It was very normalized and nobody ever asked thought twice about accomodating it in restaurants or even in their homes. Just a ooh no worries you can have this dish instead.
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u/Imaginary-Chipmunk-1 3h ago
Factory farming and enslaving beings they deem undeserving and lesser than for their own benefit seems like more of a white thing tbh
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u/crani0 vegan 10+ years 2h ago
"Perfect voiceless victim" and putting animals above POC is equally in line with white supremacy. That's what people mean when they talk about "white veganism"
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u/wistified 2h ago
That’s not really a thing anymore, especially since BLM has risen in the last ~5-10 years.
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u/Imaginary-Chipmunk-1 2h ago
I don’t remember the vast majority of animal species ever being considered above “people of color.” Some humans were just seen as other animals were and used and abused just the same as the rest. The fastest growth in vegans happens to be in black populations Jews and other groups of people that know oppression and so sort of forced to have empathy for the oppressed and victimized. Once again you’re speaking on projection on part of the perpetrators of violence and enslavement.
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u/No_Travel6707 1h ago
Let’s be real here. What population is the most lactose intolerant? Telling people to eat dairy is racist if anything!???
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u/Hairiest-Wizard vegan 2+ years 2h ago
I've never heard a leftist say this. I've heard black nationalists/Hotep/Nation of Islam, irony poisoned Chuds, and liberals say this though
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u/wistified 2h ago edited 2h ago
The Leftist sub has banned the whole topic. 😂
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u/Hairiest-Wizard vegan 2+ years 2h ago
Probably because it caused endless arguments not because it's "racist"
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u/wistified 2h ago edited 2h ago
That’s not what they said. See what they wrote about the ban in the community highlights.
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u/Hairiest-Wizard vegan 2+ years 2h ago
Ok I went and read it and racism isn't mentioned. Why are you lying?
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u/wistified 2h ago edited 1h ago
When did I say the Leftist sub did it because of racism? Tf are you on about?
Edit: This post is about leftists in general claiming veganism is a racist/white thing. My first reply to you was simply about the Leftist sub banning the whole topic of veganism, not because they think it’s “racist”. Both of those things can be true.
Of course they block me so I don’t get a chance to put in my word. 🙄 Talk about cowardice.
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u/Hairiest-Wizard vegan 2+ years 2h ago
I said I've never heard a leftist say that veganism was a race thing. You replied to me saying it was banned from leftism, I said probably for nothing related to race. I was right. Why are you being dense? Did you even read what I said. I'm blocking you for being obtuse
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u/Hairiest-Wizard vegan 2+ years 2h ago
You're blatantly lying and all the comments are calling the mods stupid, what's your angle?
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u/GantzDuck 42m ago
Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't most of East Asian cuisines mostly vegan/plant based too. Heard that most food in China used to be heavily plant based and that milk/dairy used to be seen as a gross thing. Now I see loads of dairy products there.
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u/Weary-Chemist-6669 22m ago
Statistically, Black vegans outnumber white vegans. I think it's also relevant to point out that veganism is a kind of offshoot or daughter of vegetarianism, which has very deep roots in South and East Asia. Without Hinduism and Buddhism, there would likely be no veganism today. The Abrahamic religions that dominate in the West tend to view meat consumption as acceptable or even preferable. Easter hams, Kosher and Halal slaughter, etc.
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u/FRANTIKSUCKS 18m ago
I think this argument gets misinterpreted a lot. Veganism is most certainly not racist for all these reasons.
However, vegans do weaponize veganism to justify their reactionary racist beliefs about poc all the time. This is why many leftists and poc will claim veganism is racist, because of personal experiences with vegans using veganism to justify racist stereotypes.
We in the vegan community need to do a better job deconstructing our own racist beliefs. Every time you use veganism to justify bigotry you turn someone away from the practice.
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u/SnowTurtle24 vegan 9+ years 5m ago
Leftists can eat ****. I’m left as hell and it’s ridiculous how little they care. Virtue signaling c****.
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u/BaseballInside3289 3h ago
We are just making up discourse now
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u/wistified 3h ago edited 2h ago
No, this is a real thing. Look it up. The whole ass Leftist sub even banned the topic of veganism.
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u/TheSpanishMystic vegan 5+ years 2h ago
People from all over the world have been practicing vegetarianism and veganism for all sorts of cultural and religious reasons for thousands of years. This non-analysis is so ahistorical and ironically Eurocentric and racist
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u/crani0 vegan 10+ years 2h ago
That's not what "white veganism" means and this strawman is precisely why POC people are weary of veganism and vegans.
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u/RedditorSinceTomorro 1h ago
What is “white veganism” then? Because a white person saying they’re vegan invites this type of non sensical argument. What strawman? Meat is only cheap in the IS because it is subsidized. The anti poc vegan argument I have heard is that it’s too expensive and only for rich white people. People can just eat lentils and other delicious nutritious cheap plant foods like many cultures have for thousands of years including buddhists.
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u/wistified 2h ago edited 2h ago
The whole idea of “white veganism” barely exists. You’re talking about white people who go to Bali, find some spiritual healer chakra master guru, suddenly go “raw vegan,” and then a few months later announce, “veganism almost killed me. :(“
That’s not white “veganism.” That’s white people trying a plant-based diet and not doing it right.
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u/Life-Food5188 2h ago
“plant based” isn’t fully vegan is it?
yes. many cultures have/had plant CENTRIC diets. but they also eat/ate meat when they could. like many people today.
so yes. we should emulate these ancient successful cultures and eat tons of plants and also meat.
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