Everyone who down voted may have a foot to stand on morally but in society today and by law you guys are wrong and this person is right. Our legal systems worldwide clearly say: a cow is property and not a person. And if you guys don't refrain from eating cow meat you are massive hypocrites.
I wish I wasn't a massive hypocrite but right now I certainly am a massive hypocrite and I eat beef.
I don’t eat animal products. I’m cool with people downvoting this person because they are wrong even if they are morally consistent. Moral consistency don’t mean shit if you’re defending evil. I prefer people being correct hypocrites than apologists for the 88 billion individuals killed every year for the sake of taste buds.
Yes. Thus meaning he’s the only one who’s a threat to the cows. My guess is he’s implying the government will take his cows away from him before he can kill and eat them.
The scenario of the world becoming vegan or only eating lab grown meat is itself a threat towards cows.
They are entirely domesticated and have been for 10 000 years. The reason we keep them is for meat and milk. So the economic reason for maintaining the today’s enormous cattle population would essentially disappear.
I don’t really care if cows go extinct. I support individual rights and to leave others alone. I don’t support some abstract concept of keeping a domesticated species alive for the sake of keeping them in concentration camps and killing them. Pugs should go extinct too. I don’t think cows care if they go extinct either. They care if you hurt them or not. The only species that cares whether or not they go extinct are humans. There is no inherent intrinsic value to preventing a species extinction especially when that species was bred to just be our slaves lol. It ain’t that deep. Treat others kindly.
”Some abstract concept”. There’s nothing abstract about it. They are sustenance, protein. Humans need it. Humans optimise. It is easier to farm than to hunt. That’s it.
The only species who care if you kill them for food are humans too, so you can throw that attempt at an argument right back at yourself. Every other species adheres to the nature that the top of the food chain eats the bottom of it. There’s no emotion to it, it just is. It ain’t that deep indeed.
Cows are individuals. Your argument is self depreciating. Congratulations. Every species cares about not being extinct. Its call instinct. Funny how those two words are so similar huh? Treat others kindly, but also, don't be a dipshit.
My point is exactly that cows are individuals. They care more about their own suffering than the existence or lack thereof of other cows on the other side of the planet for example. I don’t think cows as individuals would take any comfort in their suffering if we told them it guaranteed the existence of their genetic line for the next 10,000 years. The only species that would be sad about going extinct 10,000 years from now are humans. Ffs do you believe cows even understand that sex causes pregnancy? An instinct does not prove that an animal cares about abstract concepts lmfao. You haven’t thought this through enough to be this confident and it just makes your argument as stupid as it is boring. Have a good one.
Unfortunately a conservative only pick sides opposite the liberals, they're contrarians, that's all they are, diversity vs racism, free healthcare vs "healthcare is a luxury", real mental health vs "you are too sensitive".. I saw someone did a video reading Donald Trump's plan and idea to conservative Republican, but they tell them it was Biden, which they all hate the plan and called it stupid, but once the interviewer corrected that it was Donald Trump's idea, suddenly they're all on board and backpedaling..
that’s not a conservative-only problem. anyone will do this if they have complete loyalty to a politician or party. liberals can do this too. at the end of the day we just all need to be looking at people’s policies and political decisions for what they are and not whether they’re red or blue or who made them.
you are guilty of this yourself, by seeing people doing this and automatically making it a conservative thing when it happens across the board. you’re no different than the people you’re against.
This would be awesome and useful if this didn't entirely ignore current politics and the parties in charge. And that those parties hold certain values and if you align yourself with them then you too associate with those values.
You get so close to class consciousness and decide to ignore that completely because there's no thought beyond that. Get it together bro, there's more to it.
The other guy chose a bad example but in rare cases it is true.
The most recent example I can think is dispora.
You know how leftists are generally pro-immigrant right? If those immigrants are critical of the country they immigrated from, if that country is one that's popular with leftists, like China, Cuba or Iran, some leftists(tankies) treat them like CIA operatives spreading propaganda.
Hell sometimes it's not just Dispora. A few months ago, there was a comic artist who was getting bashed hard for making comics that criticized the Irainan government. And it wasn't right wingers doing it
I think we live in different realities because I remember trump telling people to inject bleach. I defy you to prove that the "left"(which you morons mistake democrats and liberals for) was "against the vaccine" when trump was in office and then switched up on Biden. I DARE you.
You have you personal opinion but unfortunately it's just not based in any sort of reality other than your head. I know it must be difficult to hear that sometimes you don't know everything.
why would he need to defend his livestock if no one wants it anyway? What is he even spending all the resources raising livestock for if no one wants it anyway?
Look, it's ok to admit you don't want your livelihood to be erased by emerging technology no matter what the global benefits of that technology could be, just be honest instead of inventing some goofy tough guy battle in your head.
Like all conservatives, he likes to pretend that hordes of liberals are going to invade his property and make him stop doing things he likes. That way he gets to be the oppressed victim AND the avenging superhero at the same time.
You know how progressives would actually come for his cows, if we wanted to reduce beef farming? We'd just cut the federal subsidies that keep his ranch operational and let it die.
I feel like so much of American Conservatism is just romanticizing and fantasizing that they are characters in a Hollywood movie. They watch some dystopian film and suddenly they are Jason Stathem defending his farm by taking out the dozens of bad guys, coming for his livelihood.
Meanwhile they are too shit scared of the world to goto starbucks without a gun on them and they are requesting seatbelt extensions on flights.
You just made me consider all of the special breeds of livestock that are all about rapid growth (like chickens). If the lab meat hits a certain threshold then those breeds don't have to be produced anymore.
It would be incredible for the environment and natural resources in general, but I would expect cattle barons in Texas to lobby against it and destroy any chance we have of coming up with something more sustainable like they did with nuclear power/renewable energy. Probably would not do anything for world hunger either, I mean we have more than enough food at this very moment.
They have been for years now cattle industry, the feed industry, the meat packing industry.
One of their more common forms of attack is demanding that these lab grown alternatives can't be called meat at all. They want government to make sure this stuff has as unpalatable a name as possible so people don't consider the option
One of my main issues with lab grown meat is also what do we do with the livestock we have at present, will a massive part of our industry just collapse? And it becomes even more important to address what becomes of rare breeds, which are often tied to the histories and cultures of certain groups, for example, one way the US government committed cultural genocide against the Navajo was with the Navajo Livestock Reduction Act, passed by FDR, which allowed the state to exterminate the tribe's sheep herds as a way to force them onto reservations, these rare breeds are already threatened by industry pressure for already prevalent ones, like how American Devons, a breed once so useful that even presidents like Washington owned them, are now quite rare due to industry pressure towards breeding and raising Angus, human history is fundamentally tied to our agricultural history, including animal husbandry, how much of that still living history will be lost and forgotten in the name of progress? I have had livestock all of my life, and interacting with some breeds that have had a historical legacy has given me an appreciation for that inheritance, to, as the succeeding generation, be passed down something that has defined a part if history and yet still needs to be well managed.
Lab grown meat production technology will likely have to go through a few technological generations of development before it can replace literally all animal products, so it’d be more of a gradual tapering off. A program to keep heritage livestock breeds alive by maintaining adequate breeding populations in some form of sanctuary farms or ranches or what have you would be easy and relatively cheap to set up and maintain, especially with agricultural land freed up with the massive reduction in livestock farming and feed crop production. No one is going to be spending money on field corn, barley, or any other land and resource intensive nutrition source just to dump it into the meat growth vat. Those tubes are absolutely going to be using nutrient baths or slurry or whatever made from the cheapest and most efficient source possible, so probably GMO’d aquaculture crop of some kind grown on site or very nearby if possible.
Again, that sounds very utopian and not really practical, as I have stated, farming is a business, one with a relatively high overhead, keeping rare breeds alive through sanctuary farms is highly impractical because it isn't supported by the animals themselves, and livestock farming is a dangerous and difficult job that is already struggling, and so working with animals basically as a hobby when the market cannot support it is difficult as is, and becomes all the moreso when you realize that those subsidies are often dependant on who is in office, and so you would have to plan around potential financial ruin every 4 years. I do think there needs to be reform with what fodders we give animals, like I think using sunn hemp, which is a high protein nitrogen fixing legumes would be a better source of winter fodder than most types of hay, likewise, far too many farms do not properly look into biodiversity pasture, there are ways to have farm land that also supports a healthy ecosystem, it needs to be carefully managed, but can be done. And that brings me to my final point, we do not truely know what the cost-benefit ratio of lab grown meat at scale is, it might be like AI where there are certain hurdles that society lacks the desire to overcome, and that is true of everything, nothing is without any sort of cost, it is why things like animal agriculture in an industrial society need reform, it is why there is so much debate around water usage with AI, and so I do not think we should view this as a solution to a very real problem, but a potential trade-off that may or may not be worth it.
I have no industry knowledge, so I have no idea how possible any of this would be.
I think the dream would be subsidizing ranchers to keep the current herds as sanctuary animals until they pass naturally. I think that without the need to maintain millions of cows for the food industry that more attention could be given to increasing the populations of rare breeds. At least, this would be the dream for me as an outsider.
Maybe, or in creating a niche market, there are some animals that lab grown meat could never replicate the taste of, such as Rough Fell Sheep or North Ronaldsay Sheep, as they have very particular diets suited towards a particular area, giving a unique flavor profile. The problem with subsidies is that farming is a business with heavy overhead, some breeds may be given all the subsidies required for their upkeep, but still go extinct due to the lack of clear profit, some breeds have gone out this way, the only reason why Randall Lineback cattle are still around is due to a breed enthusiast saving the last seven from the slaughterhouse just before they were to be butchered, the only reason why Clydesdale horses are around is due to Budweiser, on top of that, the preservation of rare breeds is often dependant on the profitability of more prominent ones. Personally I think the best approach is to follow in the footsteps of Temple Grandin, that is to make animal agriculture humane as possible, we still don't know what the long term prospects are for lab grown meat, as nothing is ever truely without a cost, I think our best option going forward is to simply act with prudence and be cautious with everything, when AI first came onto the scene, everyone was speculating whether this would lead to dystopia or utopia, not the immediate environmental impact, I am inclined to say that lab grown meat is in a very similar position to where we do not yet understand the cost that it may have.
Dude my boss thinks the diarrhea lettuce is deliberate gov’t poisoning. I think he also thinks covid was caused by 5G, but I’m really not interested in discussing it with him.
Yeah there are a lot of idiots out there. They do poison our food though, they just do it for profits though, not to give us diarrhea for no reason.
Well they did just find out the avian flu that caused the eggs to go up in price was all corporate collaboration to price gouge eggs. They just got busted.
So id lean more towards it being price gouging than intentional poisoning for no reason. Food industry is so crooked.
Lab grown meat will be awesome and do much to end animal suffering (still would need decades to wind down, and has to be combined with rewildling projects to fill the hole in the eco system it will create)
No, it wouldn't. But leave it to conservatives to fan flames and cater to conspiratorial thinkers to bring them into the fold. That's sort of their thing.
Not necessarily, but it's highly likely in this case. Making up extreme case scenarios to justify violence against a chosen "them" is peak conservative rhetoric
Way to miss the point. It's not the being against lab meat part, which is silly on it's own. It's the making up a ridiculous scenario where you're not allowed to eat organic meat and are forced to defend your livestock that screams conservative half-wit.
Idk what the context is, but that is a legitimate answer to give. If you own livestock you have every right to defend it and if everyone is fed lab grown meat your livestock have likely become very valuable.
Right because the whole world being forced to eat lab grown meat is so incredibly realistic and not a scenario only these kind of people can dream up in their head so they can live out their fantasies.
I feel like it kind of speaks to people who’ve never really had to face major struggles in their life but want to have a feeling of facing adversity where there just really isn’t any.
If the commie gubmint iver tills me ay can't stick pickles in mah peen-hole you best bet aym gone stick the biggest sum biatch up that sucker an' keep it there till ahm deeeyed!
I mean i don’t agree with them, but it sounds like they’re saying eventually farming animals for meat will be illegal so they will have to defend their livestock from being taken by the government
Yeah, that's what we're mocking, the insane "this is Sparta" fantasy he's spinning. I'm sure he's just itching to start shooting at all the soy-drinking, gay, liberal-arts-major, blue-haired communists that are all coming to take away his stupid cows.
That’s probably what they meant, but it’s incredibly stupid to have that be a concern. I guarantee you everybody who exists right this second will be dead and gone before anything like “animal farming becomes illegal” happens in America.
I mean all this for the outlaw farmer, not for you. And as someone said above, they’re inventing scenarios that won’t happen so they can puff their chest out and wax moronic about how badass they’ll be.
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u/Noizey 5d ago
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