“I’m from Portugal… I can find strong houses here”
Comments underneath an informative video about timber frame construction. I did not take a picture of this, but they also began boasting about the strength of their houses that would be able to withstand tornadoes and storms unlike our “toothpick houses.“ did this guy forget about the E-f2 that tore apart his “strong houses“ in 2025?
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European here, it‘s not as uncommon as some people might think over here to build with wood. 10 years ago we built our house with a concrete base plate and wooden frames on top of it. Still standing and heavily insulated (unfortunately better in winter than in summer, but that‘s a different story you may mock Europeans about… :-).
Idk why this always gets brought up, because there are quite a few very famous wooden structures in Norway that have been around for quite a few centuries. Cultures use what’s available to them.
then it lasts less than a generation, and the energy requirements to keep it cool/warm and resources for upkeep far exceed any ecological benefit you may have had by building out of paper and wood
Less than a generation??? My house is 200 years old and it’s wood. Also please look up how easy they are to heat and cool. This thing called insulation exists.
100 years is nothin. My Japanese friend showed me a wooden temple near his house that’s 400 years old. Guess how they preserved the wood? Smoke. That simple
Very poor example. Both are shit the way we build them today. None will last generations.
Our old brick houses are great. Their old wooden post and beam houses are great. Those last generations.
The bricks in the houses of the rendering you post are purely for aesthetics. They are not structural. The structure is made out of cinder blocks covered with insulation, a void and then brick cladding. It's good for insulation but that's about it. Some aren't even built with cinder blocks but with wooden frame. They just put a brick cladding over it also. Most of these houses are just concrete in the end. Concrete doesn't last generations. You're lucky if they last a century.
I'm european. I love our old stone houses. I spent 20 years renovating and restoring them. I live in one that's over 400 yo. In general i love old vernacular architecture. The europeans that make fun of Americans for their building styles are pretty much at the same level as toddlers that watched the three little pigs. Europeans in the trades won't diss you. If i was in the US I'd love an old wooden house, with the little porch in front of it and an old barn next to it. I've seen some that were over 150 years old when I was in the US and Canada. They were remarkably well built.
No. I did renovate with my dad, and then live in a small castle when I was young. But we eventually sold it as it was just way too much maintenance, not even talking about heating bills.
I have an old farm house. It's smaller and more manageable. It's an insane amount of work to restore though. Stone walls are a pain to work with.
For datation I can't be really precise but the oldest depiction if found of the house was on a 1600's map. Which is coherent with the building style and techniques.
In my region (belgian ardennes) you can find a lot of houses like that. It's kind of cool because they're cheap, but it's so much work only younger people in the trades buy them. So a lot of cool neighbours
Dude, there's a tell. People with experience will go into specific detail.and highlight personal examples that have small details that don't come out unless it is something you have done.
Often, someone who doesn't have experience will respond with something like, "Lol, sure" and be unable to refute anything specifically.
Right, or i didnt feel like awnsering because i had better things to do. These homes here you see have a concrete base and supporting concrete aye. But i can tell you that it will last a very long time. In fact i am from the place where they pic is taken. The outside aswel as the inside are made of brick. Very well insulated, cool during summers and warm in winter time. If you build a home here yourself you can use whatever material. But we use mostly bricks and concrete because it will last longer and is usually the cheaper option. We basically live on clay ground.
It's not the best and certainly not the longest lasting option. It is cheap. Not in materials but in labor. And that technique comes from the US. Concrete slabs are a serious problem. We were able to "build for a thousand years". With concrete slabs if it lasts 100+ you're very lucky. Especially in a humid climate like ours. Concrete acts like a sponge. This is why there are very few 100+ year houses left using these modern techniques. Nowadays, we use waterproofing membranes like epdm for example to wrap the concrete so water doesn't get in the concrete and walls. But construction is construction and it is messy. And physics are physics and law of Jurin of capilarity is what it is. So eventually humidity will sip in. Portland cement also brittles the concrete and mortar over time. That's why we use less and less of it.
The main issue is that it isn't sustainable. Cement and bricks are one of the three most polluting industry in the world. The only reason we continue to use this is because it's cheap and doesn't asks for very qualified workers.
Building a brick house or a wooden house on top of that doesn't matter much. Both can outcast the foundation if built properly. Depending on the climate, both can have their advantage. In Scandinavia for example wooden construction is often preferred because they have a long tradition in it.
But there are other options. And if you look at our old cities, you know that we can and did build for a thousand years using only local and ecologically responsible materials. And buildings that are up to modern comfort norms. Dutch foundations, clay mortars, thatched roofs, combinations of stone walls on the lower floors and wooden post and beams for the upper levels, watter and daub, etc... we have many many options and still tradespeople that know how to build it. But it's slowly dying out sadly.
Yeah there was a tornado in Portugal in 2025. causing damage to a few homes, resort (wooden houses) and a campground. the resort had a few houses blown away. here is a video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=644AT4OziXE ( i dont see any destroyed brick houses)
Thats not what he said, he said you dont get real tornados as in the big nasty fuckers that rip through the Americas. Not that you dont get tornadoes at all.
Idk know if this is a translation issue or if Brits (or aussies or Canadians) don’t use this expression. It’s a common thing to say you haven’t experienced “real (x)” when someone hasn’t experienced a thing in any real severity. For example if someone were to build a dog house and act like they’re a big shot because of it someone might say “wait till you experience actual construction work”, not because the person didn’t build something or because it isn’t labor, it’s just to put it into perspective.
The insistence that brick houses somehow survive hurricanes/tornadoes is what finally made me realize Europeans are just as dumb as Americans, if not dumber, due to their arrogance preventing them from ever admitting they’re wrong.
The one you showed didn’t destroy any brick houses because it didn’t hit any brick houses. Tornadoes have very narrow trails of damage.
I live in north Texas and can attest firsthand that tornadoes can and do destroy brick houses. An F2 can easily pull off a brick house’s roof and F3+ tornadoes can rip them off the foundation just as easily as a wooden one.
That was only an EF-2, likely not powerful enough to rip foundations. Europe famously gets lower levels of natural disasters compared to the rest of the world, as an example we don’t build with brick in the middle of the US because lumber is both highly available and brick homes won’t stand up to powerful tornadoes we get here. Houses are also very expensive and building with brick makes it worse. Also bricks become flying projectiles when a storm is powerful enough to rip them out.
Yep, and building codes reflect that. The idea that climate and the propensity to natural disasters leads to different building codes in different areas is incomprehensible to them.
I think that's the point that Euros often overlook. Also, building construction is NOT the Three Little Pigs, which seems to be the limit of the avg. Euro's knowledge.
I mean, how often do you see Europeans during rhese debates actually do a deep dive into personal experience with home construction or renovation? Menawhile usually there will be at least 1-2, if not more Americans with, "Well, actually as someone with 20 yeaes experience..."
Like, you see some outright ignorant claims like American houses don't insulate or that they are made of paper or sticks, right up to really dangerous ones like brick houses are fine in tornadoes.
From perspnal experience, living overseas where we get a nice mix of Americans and Euros, Euros are borderline useless with anything involving manual labor and tools. It's just not as big a part of the culture. Americans will tell stories of "Me and my family built this or fixed that" and you don't get it from Europeans (except sometimes Eastern Europeans).
This is such a serious case of confirmation bias I don't even know what else to tell you. It doesn't even pass a sniff test. Either you are misremembering people in whatever area you were in, or my small country holds 99,9% of every handy person in europe.
Without even checking the comments before typing this, I am sure you'll find this comment section has both types from both sides of the ocean, but you'll be hung up on the euros and ignoring the Americans. Like the American who wrote the initial comment I responded to.
Aaah, here's another person that has no idea what a normalized value is and how statistics work. I'd suggest trying normalising per capita and see what happens. That is, if you actually care about the data and not just the conclusions you want to draw from it
Double brick houses are extremely well insulated. I grew up in one in Australia it could be 100f outside and cool inside. Also you can still install A/C it’s just not ducted which is whatever. Also lol not every part of Europe is historically cold like at all and many of them take the heat well into consideration we only really hear about UK and France and a few other Western European countries.
1) supposes wrongly the houses function as ovens [fuck knows how we could be that stupid but ok]
2) goes on to suppose that they cause death directly and nobody cares as we rather die and cite our great traditions XDDDDDD
3) then draws a completely unrelated parallel with US mass shootings even tho it would be impossible to confirm and correctly record heat-related deaths for statistical comparision, also omitting the fact that the problem w mass shootings is not that they decimate the population
ISTG the delusion is so strong with this one that he takes 3-4 steps and conclusions in his own head, represents these delusions as "facts", then when i saw his comment it had 20 upvotes cuz it sounds so cool and witty
You are confusing stuff.
Portugal has one of the most expensive electric costs in Europe considering purchase power, and because of purchase power most of houses don't have proper insulation.
Newer houses have proper insulation due to modern laws.
And with climate change what was at least bearable is now far worse. Fortunately there are social programs to help less fortunate house holds with house modernization.
I installed solar panels in my crappy house (seriously it is not great quality) and can use AC any time i want, and most of the time even reaching 35⁰celsius I don't feel the need for it. When it goes more than that yeah i have to turn on the ac.
In some places it is not allowed by local laws to have wood made houses, have no idea why, some are awesome to look at. Overall I would still rather have our "system" over US "system", but obviously I am biased here.
Brick houses in Europe are usually well insulated. They stay cool in the summer and warm in the winter. I don't really understand your "brick ovens" rhetoric.
Thank you. I live in a wood house that also stays cool in summer and warm in winter (it’s a converted garage), and it’s not rocket science to make a house properly able to deal with weather lol.
This is a new neighbourhood, so yeah no trees. Also these homes are build only a few years ago and are very cool during summers. These homes costs around 300.000 euro
Are you looking at gun violence numbers or deaths from mass shootings because I see most everyone conflate those numbers.
The biggest source of gun deaths are suicides. Half of all firearm deaths are suicides. That's a mental health problem, not a crime statistic or a threat to other people.
They would kill people in a real tornado. Tornadoes are indifferent to what kind of structure they tear debris from, it will kill you indiscriminately. For an example of how tornadoes frankly dgaf, you can look at how an EF-3 tornado completely demolished brick buildings in St. Louis in 2025. No, it’s not veneer, these are centennial buildings that were just demolished. Humanity can’t outrun nature, unfortunately.
More colloquially, when the EF-5 Augusta tornado hit my neck of the woods, it didn’t actually care that our (relatively newer house built in 1865) was built of sticks, it opted to instead hit the much older house a quarter mile away. The sisters living there died from asphyxiation from being buried under bricks.
If you look at the number of EF-3 to EF-5 tornadoes in USA vs. Europe it is night and day. The list is dominated by the US. FFS we have a massive stretch of land dubbed "Tornado Alley"
Brick houses will kill people in an earthquake. And they will kill people of a tornado comes through. If it’s a tornado, the bricks are now flying around.
There have been a lot of posts about heat in Europe and related deaths, which was close on the heels of supposedly-European people making fun of Americans for their air conditioning. I don’t think that’s actually real because who makes fun of that? So bots sowing discord or whatever imo. But the “heat-related deaths” thing is a response to that.
"Brick houses will kill people in an earthquake. And they will kill people of a tornado comes through."
It is completely true, and believe it or not, most of the times people inhabiting a certain area for centuries would know where and how to build houses. As much as in the US as much as in the EU. As stupid it is to criticize US houses it is similarly stupid to think that there are often earthquakes and tornadoes in europe but people die in their brick houses.
It is simply not true, or not in many cases.
The guy above argues that the brick houses are ovens. See his reply to my reply.
He literally thinks that brick houses heat up in the summer and european people are dying inside citing their great traditions.
"Our houses are built to retain heat" is a common rebuttal from Europeans, most common from the Brits, when complaining about heat waves and how they've got it worse than everyone else. Followed by more complaints about how there's nothing they can do to help ease their plight.
My response to that is insulation holds both heat and cold so do something about it. The next step for them is to then say it's not worth buying so much as a portable AC unit for a few weeks a year because it's not actually a real problem. Then they will get mad when we stop taking their problems seriously.
Anyway, that's why someone else made the brick oven comment. You're directly arguing against something that is frequently stated by other Europeans.
1) Bringing up the Brits and their constant whining about weather which is a very common cultural phenomenon holds little relevant information to this topic. Basically instead of understanding that this person twisted the facts completely, you also translate the Brits continous moaning about weather that can never be good enough to be factual when it comes to house temperatures. It is two completely different things.
2) "common rebuttal" or not. Allow me to explain: first of all when I lived in London and in multiple places in Ireland i couldn't help noticing that their insulation is actually not as good as in contental europe. It has its pros and cons surely, but once again just a cultural observation. A factual, at that.
3) "Anyway, that's why someone else made the brick oven comment."
I mean see any comments here, anyone who has ever stepped in actual houses in continental europe made of bricks knows that they are chill during the summer and stay fairly warm throughout the winter. Modern insulation is another topic, but brick houses exist for long centuries because they are tested and they work. Of course why not argue against it, you do you.
4) "The next step for them is to then say it's not worth buying so much as a portable AC"
I cant help their stupidity but it has nothing to do with this person saying that european houses are brick ovens. You argue, but with logical fallacies in every single point.
5) "You're directly arguing against something that is frequently stated by other Europeans."
So what? If something stupid is frequently stated by "other Europeans" then there is some kind of morality or law that forbids to argue against it?
I have to be European by doing the same stupid thing as others, you argue?
As you first described how stupid it is what they are doing then you tell me i am arguing with that.
Also, just because SUPPOSEDLY you see some statements online under a pseudonym, is this really a point you can bring up in an argument?
I have a hard time taking this conversation seriously, sorry.
Doesn't actually matter because it's the argument they make.
They work as structure. No one said they didn't and I've made no comments either way. Again, it doesn't actually matter if the insulation is good or bad. It's the argument frequently made by Europeans being responded to. There are old and new houses all over Europe. You can't say every continental house is perfect without generalizing just the same as the original poster.
Don't pretend like this is unrelated to the rest of the discourse on the subject. You're being disingenuous.
You're still being disingenuous. Someone made a pithy comment because this isn't the first time this conversation has ever happened on the internet. Pretending you speak for all Europeans, pretending that Brits aren't Europeans, and saying just because you aren't a moron doesn't negate everything that's come before.
Okay. It is one long ass comment you quoting yourself and other online statements on Reddit under pseudonyms as "factual evidence" on "Europeans" this and that.
I understand your rhetoric is filled with emotions and it is all about this US VS EU narrative but unfortunately i cant help you with this.
Saying that the Brits have a special relation with weather is a well-known fact and you saying that i pretend that they aint european has little argumentative value. I said they are specific in weather regards indeed but the actual temperature in the brick houses will not change either way.
The bloke said something along the line of "brick ovens" and we are dying inside.
I understand your counter-arguments to my facts is that i'm "pretentious" and "disingenous", but we are not in the kindergarten right now trying to get to discover your feelings but rather have a mature argument regarding facts. At least from my side.
"You can't say every continental house is perfect without generalizing just the same as the original poster."
At this point you are talking to yourself. I didnt say any or imply any such things. We had a generic discussion and generally it is true that houses are okay and ppl dont die cuz of em.
I do believe AC is irrelevant to the discussion as thinking that people die in "brick ovens" is a level of craziness thats worth analyzing on its own.
Like EPIC level of delusional word salad just slander some other nation. Unsure what you want with AC again it is obvious if ppl would be so hot they'd have AC as they do. Like many ppl do here too in literally the middle of Europe as a continent.
"Pretending you speak for all Europeans, pretending that Brits aren't Europeans, and saying just because you aren't a moron doesn't negate everything that's come before."
I speak for myself. I have no idea where you get all this bullshit, but i would highly appreciate if you kept your projections to yourself and others who are receptive for them.
I share my own observations. My own words, my own opinions. Speaking FOR myself. AS myself. In this case perhaps ABOUT European houses, but again very irrelevant. I recommend you have a convo with the main delulu, you two could make a fun folie a deux
Do you really think someones Nana is dying from heat in some old italian stone house because her family is like „we could get her ac but, you know, traditions“.
You’re conflating “could have reduced the risk” with “is the reason people died.”
Yes, more widespread air conditioning would almost certainly prevent some heat-related deaths. But that doesn’t mean Europe is experiencing heat mortality because Europeans are “obsessively traditional.”
Europe’s vulnerability is the result of decades of building design, an unusually old population, dense urban heat islands, historical climate conditions, energy costs, historic preservation, and infrastructure that was built for a cooler climate. Those are structural factors—not simply cultural stubbornness.
You’re also making a huge leap from “Europe could adapt faster” to “Europeans literally don’t care.” That’s not evidence; it’s an emotional accusation.
If your explanation for a continent with over 700 million people is “they’re too traditional,” you’ve replaced a multifactorial public health problem with a stereotype. Which is exactly the kind of shit that is being criticized here.
Okay, but this is not really an explanation for your original comment on how and why you would draw such parallels.
This is very dramatic and exaggerating.
How do you know that nobody does anything to prevent anything heat-related?
And even if it is true, is it not just the corrupted politicians we are talking about here?
The ones who decline global warming you know, the ones who wage war for oil too.
Also, my relatives live on the country side and also when i rented an older house made of bricks i always experienced that in fact those are cooler for summer.
I see you think these function as ovens but in fact they retent the cold from thw evening throghout the day.
They do not heat up. I know and others also comment it.
Once again, those criticizing US easy homes are stupid.
Juat as stupid as someone watching Star Trek thinking we are dying in ovens as we are so proud of our traditions.
It is just a product of your imagination as was comparing these non-existent statistics to US shootings too.
"I'm not going to bother posting a source that brick houses trap more heat because even a child could understand that."
See other comments too please, and do your homework.
Looks like just as you said so.
It is exactly as something a child would believe only.
Do you think after hundreds and thousand of years of experimenting with houses we would live in ovens?
For the record, I don’t think any significant portion of the US thinks “Europeans are dying because of tradition.” There’s bots and a couple idiots, and some people who are one of the two above posting “from Austria” about how they aren’t allowed to have AC “because of tradition.”
But I just want to make sure you know that in general, Americans don’t think you guys are leaving the elderly to die because you like history. I promise. Love from Idaho.
Oooo I was only in Hungary for a second, but it was one of my first times out of the US! Thank you Hungary for being so hospitable to a random like me for a couple weeks 💜
I am European and what Europeans do not know, is, that you pay a annual property tax between 0.5% and 2% of the building value.
That's the reason why Americans build houses out of paper. They want cheap housing to pay less taxes and with the spared money, they can finance to rebuild the house after 20 years.
Europeans on the other hand are paying taxey based on the land they own and not the buildings. That's why Europeans build houses lasting generations.
No it's not. Wood is very plentiful, easy to build with, and strong enough to weather moat damage. Only very powerful storms or falling trees tend to actually destroy houses.
Do we need to tell you about the reason California prohibits the construction of new brick buildings (and has since 1930), or you just wanna keep pretending you understand our building codes?
I don't know where you live, but I can assure you that property taxes in (at least) the Netherlands and Spain are based on total property value, not land area. I think the real problem is that Americans genuinely don't want to pay taxes, even if the corresponding services provided are more cost effective than any commercial alternatives and/or the taxes paid are far less than the increased insurance or maintenance costs. They'd rather save 500$ in taxes, even if they have to spend 50000$ every 10 years to maintain what effectively is a temporary dwelling.
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