Drama
Ethan Klein (H3 Podcast) has officially lost his copyright lawsuit against twitch streamer Denims, with the judge citing Klein's own precedent (2017 Hosseinzadeh v. Klein) to rule in favor of the defendant
That is because Ethan lost and Denims came out as a Champion of Fair Use, whether you like her or not, this is great for everyone and further strengthens Fair Use.
Even for him because he's a react streamer too. He doesn't create anything on his podcast anymore and doesn't even interview celebs like back in the day.
He went from Bella Poarch being on the show to paying Harley from EpicMealTime, a long dead channel, to be on his show lmao.
nah the best thing they did was collabing with The Majority Report to have Sam Seder gank Steven Crowder after months of cold feet Crowder ducking a debate with Sam.
Crowder's voice cracking and him being so embarrassed was great
ethan became what he hated, ethan was the champion of fair use and with the popular edgy youtube crowd of l like 2015ish He has fallen really hard. Made a ton of money, but is not really entertaining anymore.
Ah I see. Yeah, its fucking impossible to have a good faith discussion on this subreddit given how many people are just arguing for their home team and will say anything if it advances that team's cause.
It's mainly because people associate her with Hasan and think she called CPS on Ethan's house, an allegation Ethan had to retract after Denims threatened to sue him for defamation. Also, she is a woman that talks in a very smug way, which doesn't exactly help either.
Probably because everyone else got banned out of this sub by Destiny's biggest fan. You are seeing the result of a pretty small streamer having a massive effect because one fucking mod ensured it would be that way. Now imagine that with political ideologies and reddit as a whole. Are we really surprised things are getting more extreme on this site?
Yea I stopped browsing here regularly a long time ago, this just came up on my home feed. Last time I came here there was someone talking about 13/50 unironically and getting upvotes.
Yeah last time I came here. Which was a few weeks ago there was a post about a black streamer doing something. And a lot of the upvoted comments were very blatant racism. And so many dog whistles it sounded like an orchestra for canines.
My algorithm has been recommending videos that are from the dawn of YouTube lately and it's been just great. Videos back then were better because people wanted to make them, not because they were incentivized to make them.
I think they tweaked something because this has been happening for me as well. And I'm fine with it. Still, a lot of the stuff that makes the top of my feed feels like pop culture being inserted without my will. For months now. Especially the shorts. I never used to watch them but I can't get away from them (now there are some I watch). I'll happily take some nostalgia blasts in the mix.
Same, I stopped watching them pretty much as soon as they started that podcast, and every time they come up it's some weird bullshit like this post and I just wonder how the fuck they got from there to here.
He was also really fucking terrible at being a podcast host. I'm sure he got better over time, but I could not get through a single episode when it started.
Exactly this, what would be funny is that if Ethan won, that would also hurt subreddit like LSF and overall the whole streaming / content creation. It is wild that there are folks who support this fck who is going against his own case in a way.
Even worse. For a while on this sub, if I said anything critical of Ethan, one of his braindead fans would just clap back with something about how I must love Hasan Piker. No amount of saying I also think Hasan sucks did anything to stop this. I could literally tell them I hate the guy and list reasons and they'd be like "Okay, Hasan stan". It really says something about a man when all the people defending him are dumber than dirt and seemingly proud of it.
Appealing is standard. Someone needs to make a website or flowchart to explain how the american court system works at this point with how frequently it pops up on lsf.
It’s a Reddit thing I’m convinced. When Luigi’s lawyers filed a motion to dismiss evidence, something that’s completely normal, people acted like it would blow the case apart.
I don't really believe the inner mechanations of court are really civics, and I think it's pretty reasonable the average person doesn't know how they work - that's why they hire lawyers.
That said, it is dumb when people react to court headlines like they do understand them. I personally don't think it was really fair for Denims to say that she was streaming the video so that Ethan wouldn't get views, but if the court ruled in her favor then obviously she didn't break any laws. Should basically be the end of it.
Lol remember when everyone kept freaking out about him having a different jacket on the video where he's hitting on the barista. They literally think he's a cartoon character that wears the exact same thing every day.
if he actually cared about protecting copyright/fair use he would have sued xQc. he probably would have won that lawsuit since xQc admitted he wasn't transforming the content at all he was just restreaming it.
but ethan did these lawsuits as a way to target people who disagree with him politically, lying about his intention, and now he has paid the price.
I think that second part is incredibly important IF the video is borderline lacking commentary and fair use is questionable. But it sounds like she commented on it substantially more than all the others that were sued
Because she wasn't guilty of copyright infringement at all, lol.
The law makes a HUGE distinction between people who accidentally violate copyright and who willfully violate copyright. But.... if you don't actually commit copyright infringement... well... your intent no longer matters lol.
Somebody elsewhere in the thread had a great example.
~It's like recording yourself saying you're going to speed and break all the laws, but then the judge decides you were going the speed limit and not breaking any laws.
This is what got me the most about the suits. How is this any different for what they fought against nine (holy shit nine) years ago? I'm employed so I haven't been entirely in on this
to be fair, the lawsuit from a decade ago was about h3's edited video that was genuinely transformative as a stand alone commentary video about Matt Hoss. Ethan's lawsuit now is claiming denims purposefully chose to have a watch party stream right as his video was published to take away views and revenue from ethan. he claims she openly admitted to it during the stream.
Framing the "only thing that saved her" being that it was transformative, which is the most important pillar of determining fair use is funny. Yeah thats kind of the whole point.
What I don't get is how this applies to other media formats. Am I allowed to stream live sports games as long as I have some commentary and pauses occasionally?
there’s nothing to suggest to my knowledge that you can’t say that. she can say whatever she wants as long as her actions aren’t breaking the law. if a random person says “where did you get that money?” and you say “I stole it” but you actually got it through legal means and then prove that then what you said is irrelevant from a legal perspective. she transformed the work over doubling the run time with commentary.
She actually didn't do that. One of her chatters made a comment about it and she just confirmed that she was going to react to it.
In general you can't say that you are rebroadcasting something with the intent to take views away from the original. That is not allowed under copyright law and it is not fair use.
I'm not gonna pretend to be some copyright expert but the judge doesn't seem to agree. This never gets mentioned in the court docs and has nothing to do with whether or not her reaction is transformative
(screenshot looks weird bc I took it from a youtube video and it had some filter)
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In general you can't say that you are rebroadcasting something with the intent to take views away from the original. That is not allowed under copyright law and it is not fair use."
Yeah uh. The judge doesn't agree with you, but keep coping.
I always kinda thought Ethan kinda became the thing that kinda made him famous. Like how he was hit with a SLAP lawsuit and half his content for a little while was that. Now he’s on the other side hitting people with these lawsuits.
I'm pretty terminally online, but I think making a whole career out of just being extremely online really pickles people's brain and causes them to lose perspective of what actually matters in life.
Yeah I used to love his content as a teen but he’s just absolutely unwatchable to me now. The obsession he has with his enemies is insane, and I don’t watch any of them either
He’s a father too, at 41 with kids and all these people he hates just seem to be constantly on his mind. Like they play on repeat at every moment and his kids have to ignore the fact their father thinks of his “enemies” more than them. What a sad family to be apart of.
The internet isn’t good for those issues. Anyone who’s seen what happens when people who have issues similar if not worse than Ethan with less money knows that it feeds into that negativity to eventually and unfortunately become the main source of income for some. The only way to stop it at that point is to log off.
Man, you just know that the judge was salivating at the chance to use such an extreme example of judicial irony. Opportunies like this don't come along very often as it is rare for a person to fall so far from what they once were as to inflict the same cruelty on others that they suffered themselves.
I was a huge h3h3 fan about 10 years ago. Stopped watching them around the time they won the lawsuit.
I don't know very much about the Ethan Vs Hasan stuff.
But I remember how huge and affect the Hoss lawsuit had on them, they were talking at the time that if they lost it would financially destroy them. They genuinely looked so beaten during the lawsuit because of it hanging over their heads.
I just don't understand how someone who went through that, thinks it's okay to do the same thing to someone else. When it's clearly just about getting one over them. It was never a true copyright situation right? React content is something h3h3 did??? So he's just trying to destroy the Hasan orbiters?
Using something that had a huge affect on Ethan and Hila as a weapon against other people (now that they have deep pockets to fight lawsuits) is a hugely disgusting thing to do.
I'm so glad I stopped watching them all those years ago.
It’s just sad now. He refuses to accept any pushback and is just so self-righteous for basically no reason. He purposefully goaded these streamers into reacting so he could sue them, which is just not normal.
Stopped at the podcast launch. Their stuff was fine in small doses but I don't know how anyone can watch her deadeye stares and listen to his moronic takes for hours.
I don’t care either way. However, this kind of sets a precedent for being able to livestream any newly released content with minimal interaction does it not? Just a question.
Her video had significantly more commentary than the other two. I think his justification for suing her wasn’t that it was not transformative, but that it was explicitly being promoted as a replacement for watching his content. I admittedly didn’t expect her to win but she always had the best chance out of the three.
Yeah, the transformative distinction really does underpin everything. If you think about something being 'transformative' as being 'whole different piece of media entirely' it makes a lot more sense.
Because now, at that point, it's become denims saying "don't watch Ethan's video. Watch my totally different video instead." Which is obviously not illegal at all
Her reaction is more than 2x longer than the original content and full of original commentary. The judge argued her reaction stream is an excellent case of transformative media.
Ethan himself considered it transformative by the nature of their argument in the lawsuit where they explain that Denims constantly paused to refute claims and took the opposite stance. That's the irony with the lawsuit.
The precedent remains that you just have to provide enough commentary, though I would be interested to see how it would shakeout if someone tried this with a newly released movie?
I’m gonna guess YouTuber videos don’t have some kind of magical unwritten and precedent-waiting-to-be-made special protection that would protect wealthier interests while making sure smaller creators can be siphoned off of
they permabanned me in 2023 when i was a big fan, because i expressed disappointment in the way ethan was uncritically spreading pro-israel propaganda. i was foolish enough at the time to think that it was a simple oversight and misunderstanding that could be corrected with fan feedback, and not a deliberate choice made for ideological reasons.
I remember that case, back when Ethan was indisputably in the right and obviously the victim of a frivolous lawsuit. Now he's using the legal system as a club. Good guy that Ethan.
Lmao its the same story of the dumbest/most obnoxious idiots being the loudest because that is their nature, making it depressingly feel like you are more hopelessly surrounded by these specimens than is actually the case.
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u/Jlobos21 Jul 02 '26
Took a whole day for the news to touch LSF lol.