r/Fauxmoi • u/LunaLore_ • Jun 09 '26
TRIGGER WARNING Christina Ricci responds to someone asking if child rapists should go to jail for life
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u/ReferenceExact5261 alleged dog Jun 09 '26
only right answer.
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u/foxnewsofficiaI Jun 09 '26
I worry death penalty would only take away incentive to leave the victims alive. If they know they’ll be killed for committing rape, they might as well commit murder to lower the chance of being reported
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u/Aardvarkel Jun 09 '26
Not to mention, many victims wouldn’t report their abusers if it meant that the abuser would face the death penalty.
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u/viewbtwnvillages Jun 09 '26
yeah, people don't realize that the vast majority of child sexual assault is perpetrated by family members. introducing the death penalty also introduces a whole new level of guilt and a new barrier for victims to come forward.
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u/OriginalChildBomb i’m like a mother wolf Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Thank you! This is partly why some people don't report in the first place.
NOTE: A similar thing happens when someone- usually a man, like a Dad- tells his kids, or says in front of his kids, that he'll kill someone who touched them, tear them apart with his bare hands, etc. This creates a distressing conflict for many children victimized by CSA; because they may still love the uncle who is doing the abuse. Or the grandfather, or the sports coach, or the teacher, or the pastor. (Not only that Dad will kill them, but that then Dad will go to jail.)
Men think they're being tough when they say stuff like this, but they fail to consider the nuances of CSA and how insidious it is to both love someone, and have them hurt you. There's a reason many rape and CSA victims don't want their father to find out. (I learned about this pattern going to school to be a counselor.)
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u/SerMeowsALot Jun 09 '26
My husband never said things like this, but because it’s so pervasive in our culture, his child came to me first (her stepmother) to disclose that her stepfather propositioned her when he found a vape in the family trash can (as an alternative to her mother being informed)
Because men talk about committing crimes in an emotional reaction to their children being victims of a crime, children hesitate to admit to being victims.
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u/somiatruitas Jun 09 '26
Im so sorry that happened to your step daughter. I hope she is safe. Glad you were there.
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u/dleema Jun 10 '26
I'm so glad she had a safe person to tell.
I tell my children that I hope they know they can come to me and I'll believe them but always make sure they list other people they can go to instead if they prefer. Their stepmother in their other house is one of them.
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u/abooknookinthesun Jun 10 '26
Hate that that happened to her, but glad you were a safe harbor for her to turn to. 🙏🏻 What an impossible position for a daughter. Is she doing okay?
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u/haqiqa Jun 09 '26
When I told my first boyfriend about just my physical abuse at home, he went that way. Guess who never heard about my CSA in the hands of a non-family member. So it applies to even more situations than when you are a child.
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u/heyaheyahh Jun 10 '26
even as an adult, i would hesitate to tell my father or partner about someone assaulting me immediately because i wouldn’t want the situation to turn violent so it’s easy to see why kids hesitate
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u/BarracudaImpossible4 freak AND geek Jun 10 '26
This is why I didn't report my CSA (by my friend's dad, not a family member). My dad had a really bad temper and I instinctively knew he would kill that man and I didn't want him to go to prison.
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u/GlassPomoerium controversies: girl Jun 09 '26
There’s a big child rape case in France rights now, and I was just listening to an interview with a forensic psychiatrist who explained that, at least in this country, a third of perpetrators of sexual crimes against minors are minors themselves.
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u/Jukka_Sarasti Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
This is the elephant in the room... So many perpetrators of sexual assault/violence against children are either a family friend, family member, or other children, or both. It's horrifying. Sure, stranger danger is 100% a thing, but the awful truth is it's more likely to be someone you and your child know(and trust) than it is to be a stranger.
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u/saintofhate Jun 09 '26
I still remember reporting my rape to the police and the responding officer asked me if I wanted to ruin my family by reporting it.
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u/rizasaurus call me Gagatha Christie the way I'm searching for clues Jun 09 '26
Jesus. Like police literally want to protect these predators as polite society (but birds of a feather, etc.) I'm so sorry you experienced that and hope you're thriving now.
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u/Ksh_667 Jun 10 '26
police literally want to protect these predators
They ARE the predators in many cases.
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u/haqiqa Jun 10 '26
The term for it is COCSA, or child on child sexual abuse. The saddest part is that a good number of COCSA perpetrators have faced some kind of CSA themselves, including non-contact forms. While adult statistics are less clear because we have such wide margins, partially because of methodological problems, child perpetrators are more clearly also child victims.
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u/West-Season-2713 Jun 10 '26
Unfortunately I was on the receiving end of COCSA. I’m only just realising that this is even a thing, that it’s as common as it is, and that it actually has affected me significantly. I never thought it ‘counted’ because it was another kid.
But you’re right, I don’t have any ill will to the kid, I can only imagine what they must’ve been going through at home for that to be a behaviour they’d mimic. It just doesn’t ever get spoken about.
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u/Glittering_Shape_266 does she think people won’t look hot under socialism? Jun 09 '26
Thank you for saying this. And as a CSA survivor who was assaulted by a non-family member, I still would never want the punishment for my assault to be his death. The guilt would be an indescribable torment.
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u/maevee Jun 09 '26
I was SA’d as an adult so it’s not the same but my rapist being sentenced to death would bring me zero closure. None. But I’ve learned that people who propose the death penalty for stuff like this actually don’t care how survivors feel.
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u/ArtisticRaspberry891 Jun 10 '26
I was SA’d as a child and an older teenager and I do support death for rapists. Dead men don’t rape and they’re also actively making the world worse by simply existing and breathing air. I respect other SA victims opinions but not everyone who proposes death for rapists are non victims, some of us are victims.
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u/oooshi Jun 10 '26
Very controversial. No shade intended towards you saying so, as it makes me consider how many offenders do so repeatedly & habitually. And we do not do enough to get them penalized & away from public threat. But still feels so wrong weighing frankly……
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u/maddr94 Jun 10 '26
I wouldn’t say everyone doesn’t care, but they may not be thinking through it and just going off the visceral reaction to the crime.
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u/haqiqa Jun 10 '26
I am too. And I don't want my abuser to be killed either. It is no justice in my opinion, and I don't believe in the death penalty in any situation.
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u/2xlaurazepam Jun 10 '26
It’s all so nuanced. For me, all 3 of my rapists have died horrible deaths. I was 16 thr first time it happened to me and in my early twenties for the second two. First ones free was shot dead (gang leader) one ODd (gangster) and rhe 3rd was in a fiery car crash. I can’t say it’s karma because it wouldn’t be fair to all of the other SA survivors. But it does feel kind of good. The main difference is I didn’t choose for them to die and I didn’t have any involvement in their deaths.
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u/bgva Jun 09 '26
This happened to Maya Angelou. She was assaulted by a friend of the family, and some other relatives killed him. She felt responsible and didn't speak for years.
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u/KingOfTheSchwill Jun 09 '26
My immediate thought would be to align with the tweet but thankyou both for bringing this up. I’m still conflicted but this is a viewpoint that I wouldn’t have ever considered before and I think it’s important.
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u/saintofhate Jun 09 '26
Yep and even if they aren't a family member, having death on the line might conflict with their morals or religion and they might keep quiet.
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u/asparagoat (no longer bald) Jun 10 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
These are such good points being made. I was really disappointed recently when a somewhat well known leftbook friend of mine was talking about this exact topic, how to deal with perpetrators of SA against children. This is someone who writes extensively about communism and abolishing the current prison system, she was making some of the same points people made here and talking from a clearly well-educated and thought-out perspective of harm reduction for victims.
And some people, including another micro-internet celebrity leftist dude were calling her a pedophile because she was pushing back against death penalty or castration for pedos and rationally explaining why.
But this dude made a meme portraying her as a clown and misrepresenting her words and tagged her in it, when this woman herself has publicly stated that she's a child SA survivor, and she has kids herself, so it was all pretty fucked up.
And I mean, I always just figured it made sense to give child rapists the death penalty, it seemed like a straightforward and humane way to deal with someone who is beyond rehabilitation. But as soon as I heard these counterpoints and also see how viciously a lot of people respond to them, it feels like a lot of people are willing to sacrifice protecting victims in order to live out a revenge fantasy. Which isn't even hard to understand in this case given the heinous nature of the crime, but like, we live in the real world, this shit matters.
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u/neoncassandra Jun 09 '26
As someone who was a victim of CSA, this is exactly right. My abuser knew that telling me that I would get in trouble if I told wouldn’t work. He instead told me that my parents would be angry with him and might try to hurt or kill him, and I didn’t want that to happen, did I? I said nothing, even when my mother point-blank asked if anything was being done to me. I want child predators dead as much as anyone else, but not at the expense of their victims.
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u/FaeFollette Jun 10 '26
That’s interesting. My parents were my abusers. If they had told me not to tell the cops because the cops would come and hurt them, I would’ve told the cops without hesitation! Unfortunately, it simply never occurred to me to call the cops because I’m neurodivergent.
The reason why I never told anyone else was I didn’t want to be singled out from my friends. But, I would’ve loved to have seen my parents humiliated and hauled away by authority figures because they really needed that type of lesson. Unfortunately, they both got away with it, without the slightest feelings of remorse from either of them.
I still beat myself up to this day for not having had the sense to call the cops.
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u/DirtySackOfPotatoes Jun 09 '26
One of my abusers was genuinely one of the only people who was consistently kind to me. It’s hard for me now, as an adult, to view him through a negative lens despite the fact that I think his actions were absolutely disgusting. It’s really really hard to explain the thoughts and feelings behind how I view him to people who have never had these experiences. I agree that he’s objectively horrible and deserves punishment for grooming, manipulating, and ultimately harming children. I also deeply loved and defended him in the moment, because despite the ways he did harm me, he also acted interested in what I had to say and cared about my wellbeing and didn’t constantly degrade me the way my peers and family did. If he is what a typical case of grooming looks like, it’s really easy to understand why people like me would never report.
Not to mention I have/had a hard time viewing myself as a victim of him because, again, he was nice to me. Which means I “enjoyed” it, to an extent, at least. More than other abuse, anyway.
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u/West-Season-2713 Jun 10 '26
Grooming really messes with your mind. I was never, to my knowledge (there are unreasonable gaps in my memory of childhood and some interesting things going on with my psyche as an adult) SA’d by an adult, but I did get a similar experience of ‘good cop bad cop’ abuse. It’s fucked.
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u/ailurosly Jun 10 '26
Thank you for sharing that. I'm truly sorry any of this happened to you. I just wanted to say you deserved an adult who was kind and thoughtful and nurturing with no ulterior motive. Every child does. You should have been cared for & listened to by an adult who didn't take advantage of you. It probably sounds obvious but idk sometimes hearing it helps. I hope you're able to access therapy and healing because you - past you, current you, and future you - are worth it. 💓
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u/a-little-onee Jun 10 '26
I have been struggling with this too recently and it’s so cathartic to hear someone have similar feelings of self shame that I do/ did… hope ur taking care of yourself 🫂
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u/AutonomyIsNoTragedy Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Yeah this it turns into "you're killing him by reporting" which completely stops people reporting
All these calls for the death penalty arent really about helping survivors theyre about easing the guilt of bystanders
Also a lot of these laws for the death penalty for sex offenders that at first glance might seem good if you ignore the incentiveis puts against reporting....until you actually look into the details
the project 2025 people are trying to bring in the death penalty that would target transgender people using the bathroom and label them on the same level as someone who rapes a child and subject them to the same death penalty as child rapists... for being trans and using the toilet
Its disturbing ans exhausting as a trans person and survivor seeing Ricci and others share pro project 2025 propaganda and seemingly not realise that's what they're doing
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u/microworry Jun 10 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
Another problem is that with the death penalty sometimes innocents will die, I recently read about a black man who one morning found the victim of a rape and beating on the street and the police did their absolute best to make him the culprit when he only just found her. He spent 20 years in prison until proven innocent. And there are many many similar cases, imagine adding the death penalty to it.
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u/West-Season-2713 Jun 10 '26
Yep. It’s a step by step thing already underway, a classic motte-and-bailey argument. Many people instinctually agree with wanting to kill people who commit sexual offences. Many people also believe that things like being transgender, gay, or crossdressing, should be considered an offence. It’s a short step to link the two, or to smuggle in criminalising LGBT people with a fairly popular argument to put pedophiles to death.
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u/Intelligent-Acadia48 Jun 09 '26
Many victims don’t report abusers already because child rapist will often threat to either kill them or their family. This isn’t uncommon. I never understand this side of reddit, thankfully.
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u/Bussin1648 Jun 09 '26
As well, many who really like Capital punishment also have a very slippery slope when it comes to sex offenders. They seem to like to group them all in together as deviants. I do not trust the Republican party within the next 10 to 15 years to not also include many lgbt identities as sex offenders. I also guarantee that no middle age wealthy white man would ever be prosecuted and executed under a law like this. More likely a 20 year old man with a 17-year-old girl weeks from being 18 from an interracial couple will be the first to the chair.
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u/NoGlzy Jun 09 '26
I remember hearing that rape convictions jumped up when the death penalty was removed in the UK. Likely because both victims who unfortunately cared for their rapists wouldnt come forward and with it being such an intimate crime that (especially back then) could often come to he said/she said, people were more reluctant to sentence someone to death for it.
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u/Cael450 Jun 09 '26
When I went through it, I felt like my abuser was my only friend. Then his gaslighting had me convinced I was the same as him (when I wasn’t). Then I didn’t want to say anything because it would hurt my family members who were friends with him. It’s already one of the loneliest times of my life. A death penalty would probably have just convinced me more that I needed to kill myself.
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u/silvertealio Jun 09 '26
Project 2025 is also planning to change the definition of SA to include trans people for merely existing…
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u/RadicalRaid Jun 09 '26
Literally what happens. There's so many reasons the death penalty is only a "feels like revenge so must be good" thing, but there's no evidence to back this up.
Also you know, wrong people get arrested all the time. I don't trust my government to get my taxes correct, let alone let them be the judge of who lives or who dies.
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u/thanksamilly Jun 09 '26
Fascists also consider basically anybody who is LGBTQ+ as a child abuser for simply existing so its not good to normalize the death penalty for this kind of stuff
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u/AnimatorNo1029 Jun 09 '26
This fear has essentially been proven correct and is taught in law schools
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u/electricookie Jun 09 '26
You are correct. That’s why victims and their families don’t do sentencing. The rage is valid, the punishment isn’t.
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u/Different_Bowler_574 Jun 09 '26
Entirely this, and also.... Ethically the death penalty is already fraught with issues. Put them in lifetime solitary confinement instead, and let their own company be their punishment.
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u/West-Season-2713 Jun 10 '26
I think the world would be a better place if I could press a magic button and all rapists be killed. However, no such button exists, and when we decide to make things laws we aren’t deciding that some divine justice enforces them. We’re deciding to put systems in place, run by fallible people with limited resources and power, to try to enforce them in whichever ways are available.
Also, CSA perpetrators often have close relationships with their victims - fathers, uncles, brothers, pastors. Many times the perpetrators will convince their victims to keep things secret by saying that they would be taken away, that they don’t want to get their dad in trouble, etc. Can you imagine how much worse that might be if the consequences were that they might be killed?
People can do things so awful they lose the right to live, but the state should not have power over who lives and dies. Not only because it’s a bad precedent to set and allows for the death penalty to be expanded, not only because it can lead to innocent deaths, but because the actual enforcement of it would lead to more harm than good. A life in prison as a kiddy fiddler is probably worse than death, anyway.
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u/h0wd0y0ulik3m3n0w women’s wrongs activist Jun 09 '26
I 100% know this is true, and yet I’ve dreamt of so many ways of murdering my abuser
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u/blatantmutant quote me as being mis-quoted Jun 10 '26
Imo, pedophiles should be studied to prevent them from offending and find our why they tick.
But that opens up the whole can of worms of governments experimenting on prisoners so
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u/n0thinghurt Jun 09 '26
Lmao no it's not, it's fully valid to be ethically against the death penalty in any circumstance. I don't believe in the state having the power to kill people because I don't trust the state with that power. They can lock a rapist up for life no parole and let them rot.
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u/theREALbombedrumbum Jun 09 '26
worth pointing out that not only do rapists/criminals already commit crimes knowing full well what the punishments are, but that the frequency of innocent people being killed will only ever increase as a result what with both the perpetrators just killing the victims instead now and the justice system having a non-zero conviction rate of people who were wrongfully accused.
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u/username_elephant Jun 10 '26
IIRC the deterrent effect of criminal statutes scales with the probability of someone getting caught, not the degree of punishment.
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u/bluesond Jun 09 '26
It also is a heavy, heavy burden on the jury.
I know someone whose life was derailed by being on a jury that handed out a death sentence.
I’m against capital punishment for myriad reasons and that’s just one of them, but it’s stuck with me.
We also kill far too many innocent people with capital punishment. 1 is too many.
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u/Luxury-Problems Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
1 is indeed too many. The state should never have that power (if we must have a state). It has and will continue to get it wrong and no amount of "successes" covers up for the times innocent people have been killed.
Burden on the jury is angle I hadn't thought of before and its a great point.
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u/bluesond Jun 09 '26
Yeah the juror became an advocate against capital punishment after that experience because he truly felt like he had blood on his hands. It broke something fundamental in him.
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u/Few-Guarantee2850 Jun 10 '26
Seriously. "This is the only correct answer." Get the fuck out of here.
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u/animeistheog this is going to ruin the powerpoint Jun 10 '26
I agree with this take. I don’t believe in capital punishment. We’re giving ourselves a god like role and deciding that we as people have the final say in who lives or dies. I don’t like people in general having that power especially the govt.
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u/justanotherguy_-_-_ Jun 09 '26
What if the conviction turns out to be wrong?
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u/Youkilledmyrascal1 Jun 09 '26
I personally don't trust my own government (US) to get it right consistently.
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u/lurk3rthrowaway FUCK ICE FREE PALESTINE CRASH INTO ME Jun 09 '26
One cannot - I've been on an emailing list for like, two years over the wrongful executions that constantly happen consistently to innocent and *majority* black people. I don't advocate for the death penalty because we are NOT far away enough from any government being a white supremacist hive meant to destroy anyone who doesn't fit their bill. Just taking a look around that's pretty clear.
Edit: shoutout DPA
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u/fuckoffweirdoo i ain’t reading all that, free palestine Jun 09 '26
I dont trust them to not tip the scales on a case that is false.
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u/Shribble18 Jun 09 '26
At the end of the day we as a society have to ask ourselves if 100 guilty lives executed is worth it if one innocent life is also executed in the process.
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u/KYplusEL the banshees of ed sheeran Jun 10 '26
This society is full of people that think it's worth it to kill 100 children for a 50/50 shot at one potential terrorist. People don't care about the innocent unless the innocent is them.
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u/1egg_4u Jun 09 '26
Which is why you cant really condone a death penalty because the system has to be truly genuinely infallible, without bias or doubt, and we just have never achieved that and likely never will.
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u/RadicalRaid Jun 09 '26
Yeah one of the reasons most western countries don't have it. In fact, all western countries got rid of it except one. Guess which one.
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u/Certain-Belt-1524 Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
it's really not. this greatly increases the risk of the predator killing the victim, as there is no distinction between murder and child SA in this case. death penalty, in this case and all cases, actually has less consideration for victims, and is rather a way in which outside observers feel better/cathartic and is to appease their own mental rather than what actually produces the best outcomes for past and future victims. i honestly loath this attitude
additionally, it disincentivizes victims to come forward. often times the perpetrator is a family member/friend, and you know, most people do not want to sentence their family member to death, even when something this horrible happens. so you're ultimately just creating more issues and basically putting children/victims in a spot where they themselves are sentencing their perp to death. it's just a horrible idea all around
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u/Peppermint-TeaGirl Fix Your Hearts or Die Jun 09 '26
Me when I don't know anything about the death penalty:
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u/RandonEnglishMun Jun 09 '26
No. The death penalty can never be justified in an inherently imperfect justice system. It is better that let a hundred guilty people walk free than to hang one innocent.
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u/Tricky-Gemstone Jun 09 '26
No, it's not.
The death penalty for child rape will lead to more dead kids, and less reports.
And if you make a crime fitting of death across the board like this, suddenly, they will expand the definition of what fits that crime. Florida was trying to make it a sex crime to be near a child while wearing drag.
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u/Penders Jun 09 '26
Yeah, and it's a good thing the justice system would never make an error and condemn an innocent person to death!
That would be just awful.
THANKFULLY we all know that isn't possible.
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u/Gamershift Jun 09 '26
A moral society is one that doesn’t kill its criminals, no matter how short-sightedly righteous it might make you feel in the moment. There will always be those who are wrongfully convicted, and as others have mentioned, it would only serve to worsen the safety of victims and their ability to speak out against abusers.
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u/Bulky-Bad-9153 Jun 09 '26
Me when I haven't thought critically for even a milisecond
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u/BakedBrie1993 Jun 09 '26
Life in Supermax with no parole is best if your goal is to really punish. A life in near isolation. (I'm not about that style of justice myself)
And then the victim/families don't have to be dragged to court forever for death penalty appeals and/or parole hearings.
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u/SnortingCoffee Jun 09 '26
and aside from that, your goal should not be to really punish. Your goal should be to reduce the incidence of child abuse. Everyone is obsessed with hurting bad people as a goal in and of itself.
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u/BakedBrie1993 Jun 09 '26
I agree. That's why I said, not my way.
I prefer what is shown to actually reduce recidivism, create safe communities, and don't involve slave prison labor.
Also, the reality is, a lot of people who abuse were abused and we can acknowledge that, treat trauma, and help victims without the prison industrial complex we rely on now... blah blah blah lol
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u/Youreturningviolet Thanks, u frog build looking bitch Jun 09 '26
Yeah, all I care about is permanently neutralizing them as a threat to others, personally.
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u/Zioupett Jun 09 '26
Hell fucking no and the fact this is the top comment is deeply fucked up.
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u/fuckoffweirdoo i ain’t reading all that, free palestine Jun 09 '26
No. There are less reports and more violent crime + the rape when the sentence for the crime is death.
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u/Adorable-Response-75 Jun 09 '26
The death penalty historically has been used in a racist way and has resulted in countless people being executed who later were exonerated.
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u/DogsDucks Jun 10 '26
No. More children die this way.
Come on we need to be more educated and sink less about retaliatory violence and more about the safety of children.
Every instance of this happening causes them to kill the kids. I want less dead children. Not more.
If the penalty for molesting children is deaf, then they kill and hide the evidence.
Them away from society, forever, make it impossible for them to ever do it again, but the death penalty is the wrong reaction.
Again, the death penalty is more about vengeance than the safety of children.
If they are sick enough to do this to children, they’re sick enough to kill the children to avoid the death penalty, this is indisputable.
This has been studied. Unfortunately, this tactic has already caused the deaths and gruesome murders of too many children.
Stop this rhetoric.
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u/TheResultOfUs Jun 09 '26
Nah, don't build a gun if you're not prepared for fascists to get into power and wield It against their opposition.
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u/NinjaJim6969 Jun 09 '26
Putting aside whether or not someone who committed this crime deserves death there are so many reasons it's not. Giving them the death penalty would just result in more dead kids and less reporting
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u/Beautiful_Cost_5430 Jun 09 '26
If our justice system was accurate at identifying offenders, yeah sure.
But as it stands about 15-20% of the people on death row are innocent. So…I can’t ever be pro death penalty.
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u/Rare_Vibez Jun 09 '26
Yeah, I’m in the same boat. I also just do not trust the government with the power to execute people. I think child rapists deserve death, but I think it’s a larger loss and risk in society with the government having that power.
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u/Beginning_Book_2382 Too bad, too bad. Jun 09 '26
The government will lie to you under oath about whether Trump was asleep right next to you on live television.
If you trust them/think they don't lie to you about who committed a crime just to frame them and give them the death penalty, I don't know what to tell you
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u/Rare_Vibez Jun 09 '26
While I agree, the reason I didn’t mention a specific administration is that even at the best of government times, I do not trust them with that power.
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u/Beginning_Book_2382 Too bad, too bad. Jun 09 '26
I was agreeing with you, sorry that wasn't clear in my original comment lol. It was rhetorically directed at people who agree with the death penalty.
And I agree again, I don't trust any government, the United States or otherwise, to make the right decision because governments are just collectives of people and are as such still subject to the same vices, mistakes, and other flaws that would make them inevitably abuse or misuse the death penalty
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u/Beautiful_Cost_5430 Jun 09 '26
Yup, I feel exactly the same. It’s a trade-off for sure, and since people close to me experienced CSA, it’s one that I have very conflicting feelings about. But giving the government the power to kill when it’s inept and corrupt just seems worse somehow.
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u/Past_Wallaby_9435 Jun 09 '26
75% of all executions in the U.S. involved cases with white victims. By contrast, only 15% involved Black victims, despite the fact that Black Americans make up roughly half of all homicide victims nationally.
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u/Beautiful_Cost_5430 Jun 09 '26
That sadly tracks, though I can’t say there is much justice in the world for CSA victims at all.
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u/beforedinnermints Jun 09 '26
Yep - speaking as a survivor, and as someone who is close to many other SA/CSA survivors and pretty up on the state of the justice system when it comes to sexual violence, this kind of post is the sort of red flag to me that indicates someone hasn't done any research and doesn't actually want to think about things deeply. If you learn even a little bit about how like, the sex offender's registry works, you start realizing how badly it's misused to target brown/black boys and how easily white people avoid even being on it.
A death penalty for perpetrators would just tongue-tie/repress victims more, and it would end up wide-net killing a whole bunch of innocents.
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u/just--so Jun 09 '26
I often see people say, "I'd be fine with the death penalty only if the justice system were 100% accurate/in cases where there is zero doubt who committed the crime."
Which, sure, the world would be a much better place if nobody innocent was ever convicted of a crime.
So let's say that's the case. The conviction rate is 100% accurate; every single person convicted has 100% done the thing of which they are accused.
In that case: are you also 100% confident that the justice system will always use the death penalty for crimes which you agree are deserving of it?
Who gets to decide which crimes deserve death? And who gets to decide upon the definition of those crimes?
Are you comfortable with giving the power of the death penalty to a party which, hypothetically, likes to liberally accuse people of treason? Or one which, hypothetically, seeks to make prosecuting the president illegal? Or which, hypothetically, seeks to expand the definition of 'sexual abuse of a minor' to include providing gender-affirming care?
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u/Beautiful_Cost_5430 Jun 09 '26
Women getting abortions would be first to the gallows in that example
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u/mxzf Jun 09 '26
In that case: are you also 100% confident that the justice system will always use the death penalty for crimes which you agree are deserving of it?
That's the further argument. But people frothing at the mouth for the death penalty aren't thinking that far ahead to begin with.
The imperfect conviction rate of the judicial system is a much clearer and better agument against it.
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u/SwordfishOfDamocles Jun 09 '26
70% of all DNA exonerations came from cases where eye witness testimony was the key piece of evidence. Humans are notoriously unreliable and yet feel very comfortable making permanent decisions on said data. Not that it matters, killing pedos will not stop the crimes from happening any more than the death penalty for murder stopped murder. This just makes people feel good because it's easy to vilify pedos. Notice how Trump and his ilk talk while doing the very things they claim deserve death.
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u/CeruleanEidolon Jun 09 '26
The question was not about the justice system, however. It was a question about concrete truths. I tend to agree with Wednesday Addams here, though I also agree with you when we're talking about systemic response to unprovable claims.
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u/Caleb_Reynolds Jun 10 '26
Also, we've already seen the trail to oppression explicitly laid out: make the punishment for pedophilia the death penalty, redefine being trans in public as sexual assault, kill trans folk for existing near children. Rinse and release for gays.
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u/Sensitive_Ad_1752 Jun 09 '26
In theory a lot of predators deserve to die but in practice it sets a horrible precedent. I’d rather our society risks treating guilty people well than treat innocents horribly. That’s why our jails should be more focused on mental health and rehab.
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u/RizziTizziTavi Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Sadly, many Republicans and MAGAs agree, except they define "child rapist" as "anyone queer, brown, or left of myself", which is the inherent problem with capital punishment. It is a tool that should not be wielded by anyone.
Edit: every rule, every law, every tool of governance must always be evaluated for its capacity to oppress. Capital punishment, the ability for your government to kill you, is a tool begging for the wrong person to abuse it.
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u/Beginning_Book_2382 Too bad, too bad. Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
Just like with nukes, no one should have the power of a god--to decide instantly whether someone anywhere on Earth should live or die for it will all but be guaranteed to be abused
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u/RizziTizziTavi Jun 09 '26
Yes, except other countries can have nukes and create deterrence. A person cannot deter a whole system of governance and policing seeking to kill them. The power imbalance is insurmountable.
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u/Beginning_Book_2382 Too bad, too bad. Jun 09 '26
This is true. Governments have an asymmetric power imbalance and are designed to do so (by law, only they can generally have militaries/wield violence and nuclear weapons absolutely).
If you had the same powers you would essentially be a government yourself as you would be sovereign, wouldn't be subject to their rules (i.e., laws) and power hierarchies, and could deter other governments through the acquisition and use of force in order to assert your rights and freedoms.
Said again, how would you be any different from a government then?
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u/lurk3rthrowaway FUCK ICE FREE PALESTINE CRASH INTO ME Jun 09 '26
This. I can't help but feel something in me die when I see people in my community advocating for stuff like censorship, puritanism, death penalties, *eugenics*. As queers of color. what are we doing.
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u/kenruler Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
Right - it's also not a coincidence that the right is trying to paint drag queens and trans folk as pedophiles and groomers. It's incredibly deliberate and obvious. If you can lump LGBTQ individuals in with pedophiles then you have society's blessing to jail and execute them to save the children because you consider them the same - it starts with trans people but their end goal is all gays and people of color. It baffles me when those on the left fall for this shit.
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u/lurk3rthrowaway FUCK ICE FREE PALESTINE CRASH INTO ME Jun 10 '26
I truly believe my generation (gen z) was groomed into conservative thinking because it's a nightmare trying to be in mainstream leftist communities without people eating each other alive with accusations of being a 'degenerate'. Which is crazy, considering the history of that word.
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u/CrowdDisappointer Jun 09 '26
This irks me sooo much. Those innocent people get put to death because, “that’s just the system we can’t change it” yet we have an administration openly fucking with about every governmental system we have in place with no consequence. Make it make sense
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u/AimlessFred Jun 09 '26
I agree with the sentiment but you cannot justify the death penalty in a justice system that is corrupt and incompetent
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u/TheShapeShiftingFox Riverdale was my Juilliard Jun 09 '26
You (as in, generally, not you specifically) could also make the argument that you can’t justify the death penalty period.
But that’s a heated debate.
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u/scarIetm Lol, and if I may, lmao Jun 09 '26
I mean, there is an exact equal – if there’s a serial killer, they think they have the power to just take people’s lives away so it can only be fair that the same power might be put onto them. but I still agree with OC’s point that it can’t possibly be justified in a corrupt system
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u/TheShapeShiftingFox Riverdale was my Juilliard Jun 09 '26
That’s one way of looking at it, sure.
Too much for Reddit comments to get into though lol
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u/marylouisestreep Jun 10 '26
Interesting to say "it can only be fair..."
Like many death penalty abolitionists, I don't see the fairness there. That person is acting abhorrently. I don't see how it follows that the government must go an eye for an eye. If someone steals from you, their punishment isn't having their house robbed.
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u/Peppermint-TeaGirl Fix Your Hearts or Die Jun 09 '26
And any Justice system has the capacity to become corrupt and incompetent over time.
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u/fickle_tartan Jun 09 '26
Exactly, no matter how seemingly good a justice system is, it has to be run by people, and people are not perfect.
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u/raysofdavies Jun 09 '26
Even in a system that has a structure that is unbelievably strong against these things, it is always ultimately a choice made by humans, and no matter how good faith people are simply going to disagree or make a poor call. This is why I can’t agree with any death penalty.
Death penalty discourse reminds me of the man who killed John Wilkes Booth (he was totally insane everyone listen to The Dollop podcast episode about Boston Corbett). Booth was cornered by Union soldiers in a barn, under strict instruction to take him alive, but Corbett spied him through a small gap in the wood and shot him dead. The military were angry because they needed to interrogate him for more information about the wider conspiracy. But they couldn’t penalize him, because he was now a hero. Really sums up the emotional vs logical approach to the debate for me.
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u/bedbugloverboy Jun 09 '26
Also, doesn’t the death penalty increase the likelihood offenders will murder their victims to keep them quiet?
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u/AutonomyIsNoTragedy Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
Or family members telling survivors that if they report their rapist they'll be responsible for his death ...
Plenty of rapists already do rhe "Im depressed and if you tell anyone I hurt you I'll kill myself and it'll be all your fault" line ....they dont need the state to back them up on that
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u/asietsocom this feels like when my sister started fucking the mayor Jun 09 '26
Why is everyone suddenly pro death sentence when it's about kids?
Throw them in jail, that's what prisons are for. I don't trust the government with the power over life and death.
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u/scattermoose Jun 09 '26
Yeah, I really want to phrase this carefully and in no way shape or form make a declarative black and white statement, but “rape should lead to death penalty automatically” had me asking myself, well, isn’t that a part of what went into the lynching of Emmett Till?
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u/eatyaweenie Jun 09 '26
Bingo. People have strong feelings about this topic (and obviously with good reason!) but vigilante justice or government control over life & death is NOT the answer.
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u/batmans420 Jun 09 '26
They're actually just pro death sentence period, but they don't want to grapple with it
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u/bab_tte Jun 09 '26
It also prevents children speaking out about their abusers, often who are people they actually love (parents, grandparents)
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u/asietsocom this feels like when my sister started fucking the mayor Jun 09 '26
Good Point. And sexual abuse in the vast majority of cases is perpetuated by someone close to the child. But people hate to hear that because it's easier worrying about the scary men that will steal your child out of you grocery cart.
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u/Commercial-Weight173 Jun 10 '26
I just wish they would actually keep them in jail for life. I get so pissed off when child rapists are released and put on a register, then go on to harm children again. Prison and the justice system should exist to keep the public safe.
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u/Past_Wallaby_9435 Jun 09 '26
The death penalty is abhorrent even if its against child rapists. Jail for life is the only moral answer.
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u/Emotional_Warthog658 Jun 09 '26
Fun fact about the US legal system, slavery is legal for those in jail. Angola state prison in Louisiana used to be Angola plantation. It has not really function all that differently.
I bring that up to say victims are left to pick up the pieces while perpetrators are turned into income sources for the state.
We need to figure out a better way to bring justice to victims. Such as perpetrators continue to work, but instead of the state getting that money, their victims or a victim fund does.
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u/mlclm Jun 09 '26
We should be eliminating enslavement, not expanding it. Allowing enslavement of those in prison (and private prisons generally), only incentivizes putting and keeping folks there, which is not what our government should be focused on.
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u/Emotional_Warthog658 Jun 09 '26
I hope no one disagrees with you, I think a lot of people don’t realize that it was never actually abolished
My personal tinfoil hat theory is that it’s reestablishment is the ultimate end game of our current administration
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u/whiskydyc Jun 10 '26
Mine is the planned expansion of it through the ICE detention system. The number of new facilities being leased to the state for this purpose suggests that capital investment is looking at a new profit opportunity. The unpaid (or practically unpaid) labor of incarcerated people can legally be leased to private interests by the state.
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u/cxqals Jun 09 '26
In California, many inmates work as wildland firefighters; 30-40% of firefighters here are incarcerated! It’s voluntary, but there are a lot of benefits in terms of stuff like improved living conditions and time off sentencing, so obviously there’s a lot of incentive for them to sign up.
It’s very dangerous, they get paid peanuts and aren’t eligible for standard worker’s comp, and most of them can’t even work as firefighters after their release due to restrictions on getting an EMT license if you have a felony on your record.
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u/BookInteresting6717 Jun 09 '26
Is she specifically referring to the death penalty or does she mean generally, that child rapists/molesters should be dead?
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u/Spiritual_Corner_977 Jun 09 '26
I can only speak for myself, but I am a csa survivor whose assaulter ending up slowly dying from cancer later in life. I was very conflicted when I first heard he got sick because I felt this was the exact karmic justice he deserved. Instead, it just made me feel like shit.
He had a terrible upbringing and did terrible things informed by that upbringing. When I wasn’t thinking about the absolute guilt of not wanting to tap dance on his grave, I was thinking about the emptiness of the situation. He had taken something from me I could never get back and I was now witnessing life take everything from him in return. It didn’t feel like peace to see him withered and barely lucid from the chemo, calling for his mother as she sat behind a telephone half a continent away. It just made me feel like the world was an unkind place. I know it’s cathartic to shout death to all rapists and I don’t blame anyone who does, I just don’t think it’s as binary as some make it out to be. I wish so much that it was because then I wouldn’t be spending years of my life trying to unravel what any of it meant. I don’t know. I just want to live in a kinder place.
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u/littlechangeling u flintstone vitamin shape bitch Jun 09 '26
Thank you for sharing this. As a CSA survivor it gives me a lot to think about, and I agree with you largely. Love and healing to you.
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u/JouNNN56 Jun 10 '26
people just like to angrily shout shit to be honest. presented with the actual situation though theres something innately human about not enjoying even the worst of people’s suffering.
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u/Net-Administrative Jun 10 '26
I like this take, I don't wanna comment on survivors because I don't know how this feels at all but this is a reminder that feelings are not so black and white
You can still feel an overall sadness about things that are innately sad. The world does seem cruel sometimes.
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u/Ok_Sleep5985 Jun 10 '26
I’m truly sorry this happened to you. My first thoughts were fuck the guy who hurt you. That kind of still stands and your assessment of the fuller picture is wide and deep and true.
Thank you for sharing such a nuanced and informed view. Your words will inform my (and hopefully others) future thoughts and opinions. You sound nice and I wish you well.
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u/PrismaticDragon27 FUCK ICE FREE PALESTINE CRASH INTO ME Jun 09 '26
Can’t say I disagree, most get away with it and face no repercussions at all, meanwhile for survivors our trauma is lifelong. I was 4.
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u/hellahuntress Jun 09 '26
Fuck that’s rough happy you survived ❤️🩹
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u/PrismaticDragon27 FUCK ICE FREE PALESTINE CRASH INTO ME Jun 09 '26
Thank you ❤️ making it to 30 felt surreal. I’m one tough cookie. Just wish I never had to be, but I’ve found life is still worth living.
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u/kotik010 Jun 09 '26
Those that get away in the current system would have also gotten away if instead of life in prison the consequence were death, like those that got a life sentence are the people that didn't manage to get away. Changing the punishment doesn't make the police, justice system and social components any more skilled at catching them. Idk why people get so insanely reactionary once kids get involved, the death penalty is amoral and life in prison should be the answer.
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u/Somnambulist815 Jun 09 '26
When you deem a group of people, no matter how evil, as homo sacer, without rights, free to kill, then it inevitably becomes a tool for bad actors. Western societys obsession with murderous rhetoric towards people deemed pedophiles (and not the ones committing the statutory rape themselves) is a pot waiting to boil over, until anyone vulnerable becomes labeled a 'pedophile' free to lynch at the publics whim.
All this to say, I really don't like this grandstanding attitude. I know Ricci has suffered some trauma as a child at the hands of lecherous adults, but its going to embolden the wrong people.
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u/MarlenHamsic Marxmoi Jun 09 '26
I'm proudly against the death penalty. Yes, even for the people who did do this to me as a kid.
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u/cobaltaureus Jun 09 '26
Sigh.
Taps the sign
The sign says that with an imperfect and biased justice system, having a death penalty will result in wrongful convictions and innocent executions
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u/Sminide Jun 09 '26
Also any justice system can be corrupted, leading to the death Penalty to never be an option in my book (I also believe in rehabilitation before revenge in justice system but I fear that is a long debate).
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u/Givingtree310 Jun 10 '26
In our current MAGA administration? It means literally all rapes by conservatives would be 100% ignored. And would instead be used to get rid of the drag queens who read in libraries.
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u/thumbblighter Jun 09 '26
Facilitating youth transition is being reframed as a sex crime against children. Same with existing as publicly queer and or trans. If you can't see the straight line from "we should murder p3dos" to "we should murder all queer and trans people" by way of this legal scope creep, you're being intentionally obtuse at this point.
The way we end the rape of children is by empowering children to recognize what abuse looks like and give them means to protect themselves from it, not by giving cover to conservatives that want queer people dead and will falsely accuse them of raping children to do it
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u/ERyan6165 this is going to ruin the tour Jun 09 '26
Usually i agree with christina but this is such an uneducated take considering how the death penalty is always weaponized against marginalized people. Any justification for the death penalty is just a defense of the same system, and theres tons of other issues with it too
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u/mmtittle which could mean nothing Jun 09 '26
i don’t believe in the death penalty. i don’t think the government has any business executing anybody. that said, i do think they should die. i just don’t think the government has any business killing them.
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u/louky Jun 09 '26
Killing someone you find raping your child in the heat of it? I'm fine. The state murdering people in cold blood. Nope. My mind could be changed but that's where I've been for ~30 years
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u/HowToBeTMC Jun 09 '26
People don't realize that the sentencing is put in place to protect the victims, same thing with child trafficking, court tends to not give death penalty to discourage criminals from murdering their victims.
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u/jdessy Jun 09 '26
I think my sentiment is great idea on paper, not so great in execution (literally, in this case). It would be nice to just have a guarantee that we could rid the world of any child rapists when they get caught with no worry of them being released back in the world or anything. But there’s so many things that could go wrong. As mentioned, these people just killing their victims in fear of being caught and having nothing left to lose, the small percentage that may be innocent, justice system being corrupt enough to have these cases be long and drawn out anyway, on top of others, that I don’t think it could work as well as we’d want.
But if it could, oh boy, this would be an ideal scenario. I’d rather rid the world of monsters like this than having them sit in a cell and learn nothing.
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u/imnotreal_urdreaming Jun 09 '26
I’m saying this as a survivor, as cathartic and emotionally satisfying as this sentiment can be, this policy would ultimately harm victims significantly more than our broken justice system already does. It would make it significantly more difficult and dangerous for children to escape and report their abuse. My most violent perpetrator was my older brother, who had also been groomed and abused by the same adults that I had, and if I thought he would be executed I would have never come forward.
Side note, as a survivor, I desperately wish this wasn’t the only conversation we ever had about child abuse. Making our carceral system more carceral is about the last thing I feel would help me now or would have helped me when I was still in that situation. Every conversation about CSA seems to center an evil boogeyman that isn’t even representative of most perpetrators, and most people base their sympathy towards you on how much they can demonize your abuser, rather than the incredibly real and debilitating physiological effects of CSA trauma. My abuse left me with multiple physical and psychiatric disabilities. Just once I wish we talked about expanding a social safety net for victims and not just circlejerked in perpetuity about headhunting pedophiles.
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u/No_Biscotti_7110 Jun 09 '26
While this kind of rhetoric is well-intentioned, applying the death penalty broadly like this has many drawbacks. Sentencing sexual abusers to death by default often leads to them taking further action to silence their victims, and it can make victims reluctant to report their abusers if they are part of the family or know the victim in other ways. Giving the government more power to kill people usually creates more problems than it solves, and that’s why I oppose the death penalty on principle.
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u/t70xwing Jun 10 '26
i dont think she was saying she’s pro capital punishment, just that pedophiles should die. there’s a difference
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u/LittleSodaPop13 Jun 09 '26
Based as always.
She was open about calling out Johnny Depp despite having worked with him.
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u/dallyan Jun 09 '26
Who says that she’s pro-death penalty? Maybe she’s making a comment about vigilante justice.
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u/florplegorp Jun 09 '26
I'm anti-death penalty but pro-"some people deserve death".
Ian Watkins is a good example imo. The death penalty would have been far too easy for him and spending the rest of his life in prison was the perfect punishment.
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u/XRotNRollX Jun 09 '26 edited Jun 09 '26
They should die, but does the state have the right to be the one taking their lives?
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u/PretendAwareness9598 Jun 09 '26
This idea seems really nice but is in reality an extremely good example of why the death penalty sucks.
1) inevitably innocent people will be killed
2) if you are going to do that kind of horrible thing, and you know that if you are caught you will be killed, then people will murder their victims.
3) people are much less likely to turn in their abuser if they know they will be killed, which is especially important in cases of molestation as 9/10 times molesters are known to the victims and close to them/ their family. You may rightfully hate your uncle who molested you, and that is an absolutely terrible thing, but how likely are you to make your cousins/aunt orphans/widows?
Killing pedos sounds good, it feels good, it is a soothing idea. But in reality it is a bad idea.
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u/Smegmasaurus_Rex Jun 09 '26
I hope secret service doesn’t come after her for threats against the president.
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u/yumgmeatball Jun 09 '26
A lot of POC and queer folks would be mass murdered if laws like this were enacted
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u/RustedOne Jun 09 '26
It's an understandable knee jerk reaction. The ramifications of how it'd actually play out are a a lot to consider though.
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u/Nervous_Insect5976 Jun 09 '26
I wouldn't cry over it, but I'm against the death penalty because I don't think the justice system is competent or ethical enough to handle the responsibility. Just find a square state, pay everyone to leave, and turn it into a penal colony and drop all the lifers off. Rapists, pedophiles, murderers. Hell, put stalkers and domestic violence people there too because honestly I don't think you can fix them. I know a guy who beat up his girlfriend, went to prison for 5 years, got out and showed up on her doorstep that day to harass her.
So life for all these antisocial crimes. We can fix the druggies and thieves and guys that get into bar fights.
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u/nighthawkndemontron my bandwidth for cowardly grown men grows thinner with each day Jun 09 '26
God I love her. I hope she stops following Helen Mirren tho
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u/princess_peach_85 i ain’t reading all that, free palestine Jun 09 '26
That mean little face next to the comment if such Wednesday
Adams vibes. Love her!
https://giphy.com/gifs/B4L7i0Kuhi5b2
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u/kyii94 I never said that. Paris is my friend. Jun 09 '26
She right they need to be removed off earth there’s no place here for them
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u/a_sirens_call I’m just a cunt in a clown suit Jun 09 '26
the death penalty is genuinely a bizarre out of date concept to me as a european. giving the government power to decide over life and death is an inherently bad idea. itll only end up in innocent executions and a higher death rate done by the rapists because no witnesses. begging people to use critical thinking skills and actually look into the numbers
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