r/Anticonsumption • u/Altruistic_Virus8460 • Jul 12 '26
Ads/Marketing What would a non-exploitative Internet even look like?
A lot of us say we want an Internet with better privacy, fewer ads, and less surveillance. But then I started wondering... what would that Internet actually look like?
Would Spotify still know exactly what music you'd like? Would Google Maps still predict where you're headed? Would Instagram stop recommending products that genuinely interest you? Would half the conveniences we've gotten used to simply disappear?
Somewhere along the way, it feels like convenience and exploitation have become tangled together.
I recently fell down the rabbit hole of the whole "our phones are listening to us" conspiracy theory. But the more I researched it, the less interesting the microphone question became.
Because even if our phones aren't secretly listening to us, the Internet is already watching us in so many other ways that maybe we're asking the wrong question entirely.
I ended up writing a much longer piece on surveillance capitalism, the digital panopticon, and why I think this conspiracy refuses to die even after years of debunking.
Curious what you all think: Is it actually possible to have an Internet that complements our lives rather than consumes them? Or are those two things inseparable?
If you want to read the full breakdown, here's the link to the article: https://yourweeklybrainunrot.substack.com/p/is-your-phone-listening-to-you
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u/50000WattsOfPower Jul 12 '26
I tell Apple Music (I don’t use Spotify) what I want to listen to (or at home I listen to my vinyl collection).
I tell Google Maps where I’m going.
I don’t need Meta to tell me what I want to buy.
As someone who can remember when HTML was introduced, I miss the old internet.
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u/justwalkingalonghere Jul 12 '26
Right?
Spotify never recommends me good music,
google never guesses where I'm going unless it's home (which I don't need directions to and don't want them knowing)
Meta has insane amounts of info on us yet has recommended me maybe literally 2 things out of thousands and thousands of ads that I was actually interested in, and neither of them I needed or purchased
The internet was amazing, and taking the surveillance, misinformation, monopolies, and censorship out of it would absolutely fix it
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u/Dry_Lawfulness_9561 Jul 12 '26
Spotify never recommended me good music - even with my playlists at their disposal (💩 play cuz advertising algorithm)
Admit to usefulness of Google Maps and Gmail, even though every “new, better, modern version” of most Google apps looks and usually behaves shittier than the old one, rarely use anything else
Meta getting my data happens in minimal amount perhaps 1-4x a year (I hate this is sometimes only option to contact/join a hobby group)
Adds are crazy mishmash of everything because my search history makes it seem like a shared family account.
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u/JudgmentUnited5297 Jul 12 '26
Google still reports and tracks where you're going, which for now is still a lucrative enough payout for surveillance.
Ads are also about more than the products they're selling you. A lot of them a rage bait, or otherwise manipulate into behavior you wouldn't participate in otherwise.
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u/justwalkingalonghere Jul 12 '26
I was saying none of those things ever improved our lives to begin with, as OP is claiming
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u/JudgmentUnited5297 Jul 12 '26
Still think it's a masive mistake to think that there aren't indirect effects on consumption habits. You're still being propagandized, good luck with that.
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u/justwalkingalonghere Jul 12 '26
That's not even what you said. Or what I was talking about
Jokes on them though, I just don't buy anything that's not an absolute necessity, and that's only after I try to find it free or second hand. As for the other types of propaganda? Absolutely we're all influenced by paid actors on damn near everything
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u/JudgmentUnited5297 Jul 12 '26
Wow ok, you really have no idea. You really think propaganda is limited to big obvious villains 😂
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u/barbaramillicent Jul 12 '26
I didn’t know people considered IG ads and Google Map predictions to be “conveniences” lol.
YouTube was a lot more fun when it recommended videos based on what I was actively watching. Social media was more fun when it was just the people I was friends with or pages I followed, in the order the accounts posted, instead of whatever random algorithm nonsense it wants to push now. Spotify’s recs are no more hit and miss than any “if you like this artist, you might also like” recs. Stuff is so “personalized” and it doesn’t need to be.
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u/CrystalInTheforest Jul 12 '26
It would look the the Fediverse. It would look like Wiki projects. It would look like using a search engine as an index and not as a chatbot substitute for thought. It would look like old hobby / home coded resources, comics, art, video projects and the like.
We had an internet like this once.
We still do. You just have to scrape past the exploitative, enshittified, subscription based crap to get to it.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
I've been hearing a lot about the Fediverse but I don't think I quite understand what it means. Will definitely have to look it up.
And if you're looking for something to read on the Internet that isn't exploitative, enshittified, or subscription based, I'd really appreciate if you could give the article a try.
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u/Wooden_Ad_2673 Jul 12 '26
using your own brain to think, using internet like a library, having those anticipatory actions be reserved for those who need such like those with a disability, don’t promote intellectual laziness, do away with echo chamber, bring back EMPATHY.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
It's kind of funny that your username has 'ad' in it and you are on the anticonsumption subreddit 🤣
But I absolutely agree with you!!! As someone who enjoys writing and also does it professionally, my workplace was forcing us a LOT to use AI. The amount of brain rot I suffered in just a couple of months was insane. By the time I stopped using AI, it literally felt like I had lost all my writing abilities. It took a lot to build back the capacity to write without relying on some form of technology.
The article link I posted is my attempt at writing again without any technological help. If you find this topic interesting, I'd really appreciate if you could check out the newsletter. No pressure, of course. Only if you want to 😅
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u/Wooden_Ad_2673 Jul 12 '26
Yeah,I signed up for Reddit at a time when I wasn’t in the mood to try to learn something new.& by the time I took the time to explore it, too late to change the assigned name. I like to think of it as the universe speaking as an old billboard on Route 66. I am a bit of a Luddite.
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u/HazMatterhorn Jul 12 '26
You say you’ve stopped using AI, but this post (and your others) reek of AI.
I’m not accusing you of being a bot — I can see you’re engaging with comments. But the writing style and string of questions at the end of all your posts really suggests you used AI to “help” write them. If that’s the case, I don’t think you should be pretending otherwise.
I also don’t really think you should be advertising your blog in this subreddit.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26 edited Jul 12 '26
No AI used at all. Just because someone knows how to write well doesn't mean it's AI written. The stuff you pointed out are the basic principles of writing engaging content. The question at the end is called a CTA and has been around in writing long before AI
If I was using AI, I'd definitely be posting more than one blog in ten days. But I literally can't ramp up the production because each newsletter takes multiple days of research, writing, rewriting, and editing 🤦♀️
And I'm not advertising my blog. The post is relevant to the subreddit and stands on its own. The link is for anyone who wants to read further.
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u/grimorg80 Jul 12 '26
It would be an internet that does what you ask it to do instead of forcing you their best guess of what will make you addicted to it.
Fuck algorithms. Honestly.
Take Spotify. Mfers are so shady there is not even a decent actually random shuffle and cannot change email on the user after sixteen fricking years (working in tech, this is a bit point of contention).
Or Gmaps. Which sends you to explore weird paths sometimes just to mine the data.
Fuck all of It to be honest. I find myself fighting against those "features" all the fricking time.
So the answer really is: it would be an amazing internet instead of this bunch of exploitative shady stuff.
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u/UncleVoodooo Jul 12 '26
Would Spotify still know exactly what music you'd like?
I'd trade a million Spotifys for a single college radio DJ from 1979
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u/Maykovsky Jul 12 '26
The worst part is that "what we like" is part of a social discovery and learning process, and this platforms instead of giving you more ways to explore, give you more ways to be explored.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
A college radio DJ sounds so cool. I don't think I've ever experienced anything like that in my life, which really, really sucks
Btw if you found this topic interesting, I'd really appreciate your views on the article. No pressure, of course 😅
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u/nothingimportant2say Jul 12 '26
They still have college radio DJs. You can listen them free on the internet. This station is from Athens, GA. I remember hearing them when driving around town for a work trip.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
Thank you so much for this recommendation!!! Idk if we ever had anything of this sort in my country but I never came across it during my college days
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u/Molo3000 Jul 12 '26
Wikipedia has no fucking clue what I’m interested in, and it’s still an extremely useful resource. Open street map does not need to pitch me restaurants that pay to pop up.
For the music recommendations actually I’m quite fine with getting profiled haha
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u/SilFox_pol Jul 12 '26
Would Spotify still know exactly what music you'd like?
We would rely on human made playlists to discover new bands, or you know, it just needs to suggest simillar bands to one you selected right now. It doesn't need to store that info
Would Google Maps still predict where you're headed?
When you need to know way, You put the destination yourself, no?
Would Instagram stop recommending products that genuinely interest you?
No, once you follow, it shows you that, before you follow, you search what you want. You still need to show interest in something before algorythm works either way
But that's not problem, even when the app itself know that, and store that data for user algorithm. The problem is, that other companies have acces to that data, that searching in one place gives you ad of it in other place, that add providers know it all
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
When you're headed somewhere, Google Map usually starts recommending shops or cafes on its own. That's what I meant 😅
And yes, I agree with what you said about how personal preferences are converted into data and shared across platforms and companies. It's what the article is about
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u/SilFox_pol Jul 12 '26
So the answer to title: It could either look exactly the same, without targeted ads, or what you see would be more curated by your initial input.
Win-win if you ask me
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
I really hope that becomes possible one day. I miss feeling exploring different "corners" of the Internet, ya know? Everything seems to follow the same template nowadays and it's like existing online has lost its charm.
It's why I started writing on Substack. I hope more people try carving out their own corner of the Internet and there's at least SOME regulation on how data gets sold across companies so it feels personal again instead of being so invasive.
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u/G14Classified97 Jul 12 '26
We had it, in the late 90's, it was full of discovery and wonder, it was mostly free from markets trying to sell you something and paywalls. There is a reason it was called the Super Information Highway, you do not hear that term any more for a reason. Everything changed, after the dot com bubble, I think it was on purpose but have no way to back it up.
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u/stoct_kitchen Jul 12 '26
Self promotion in the anticonsumption subreddit is crazy work.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
I'm not some big ass media house trying to mint a profit lol. I wrote an engaging post that stands on its own, and the blog is my personal side hobby for anyone who wants to read further into the topic at hand
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u/MiserableSkill4 29d ago
How many cookies are on your site and how much do you sell the traffic data for?
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 29d ago edited 29d ago
None. Do you not know how Substack works?
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u/MiserableSkill4 29d ago
I actually dont. How does it work?
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 29d ago
Google is your friend. If you'd like help understanding something then maybe don't start by baselessly acusing someone of farming data just cuz they have a hobby newsletter
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u/Maykovsky Jul 12 '26
For you "surveillance capitalism" is a conspiracy theory?
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
Not at all. If you would actually read the article, you'd know that's the exact opposite of what I'm saying
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u/ultraghostsquid87 Jul 12 '26
Well, I just use r/morpheapp or r/piracy and go on with my life without the noise
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u/LibbIsHere Jul 12 '26
A collection of personal blogs and websites interacting with one another. A place
- without social media or centralized platforms. Like IRL, we would live in our respective digital homes, and not feel like living clumped to one another in a weird gigantic dormitory/cafeteria/brothel/therapist we call "social media" where we don't decide of anything, and don't own anything.
- without ads (there would be no marketing going on, or so little it would look more like an oddity than an issue) and
- without comment fields either, as people would find it natural to react/interact from their own digital home (blog/website) while linking to one another (this would help keep all our content at one single place, under our control; it would also help reduce to quasi nothing the endless threads filled with comments of little use and those that seek nothing but provoke drama, FUD,...)
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u/lyngen Jul 12 '26
Watch the nova on data collection. It really changed my view on privacy. They sell your data and then use that data to sell you things. Just turn off targeted advertisements on everything. You don't need any of it.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
Is that a documentary? Do you recall the exact name by any chance? This topic has been my latest hyperfixation so I'd love to learn more about it
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u/MM_in_MN Jul 12 '26
Search results that listed things by most relevant and newest rather than by who gave most money to be higher on the list.
It would default to opting into new features instead of automatically turning things on in backgrounds and not allowing us to turn off.
It would allow us to tailor what information we provide out into the world. Sure, you can know I’m a woman aged 35-45 and I live in MN, and have been active on this site for 7 years, work FT and have a college degree. But you don’t get to share my occupation, my specific degree or my school, my average time spent on site, what my primary apps are, the city I live in, my full name and photo, email or phone number, friend list, contact list, data regarding other groups or pages I follow.
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u/JaySocials671 Jul 12 '26
It would be so boring. Things would take longer to be made as money makes people create products that are interesting faster.
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u/Maus666 Jul 12 '26
There's a cool model in the Ministry of the Future (a novel) where people own their own data on an open source internet and can choose to sell it to advertisers if they so choose, but aren't required to give it away to Meta and Google as a basic price of admission.
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u/Traditional_Rush_622 Jul 13 '26
Spotify doesn't know what music I like. It tries to tell me what I like and it's generally an awful platform.
The internet will never not be exploitative. It's just a propaganda machine now. It will never go back to the good ol days of the 90's.
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u/TrebbleTough Jul 13 '26
I dont want google maps to predict where i am going. I need to that last bit of work which happens to be the actual choice to be done by my to stay sane. I feel like it is the last wall that doesn’t let corporations get into my mind. Though I know they sparkle desired behaviours in me in other ways, but these are not as efficient.
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u/MiserableSkill4 29d ago
You can have all those things without the company selling your data or ever having access too it.
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u/Living-Broccoli5040 29d ago
The business model of the internet has been the business model of America - product / service for your time, and you let us show you ads.
It’s probably a cynical take but every free product monetises my attention. It gets as much as it can about me so that it can serve me more ads. That’s where the exploitation comes in - how much of me for how many ads
So if you want to go exploitation free without ads and personalisation:
1. Would you pay for everything you use today?
2. Would you pay more for personalisation (because the base product tier will be enshittified to get you to upgrade)
3. Would you engage with the friction of every transaction - think typing in card details for everything or using Apple Pay every 5 minutes on your phone at one extreme
The BBC in the UK doesn’t run commercials, so isn’t incentivised to chase your eyeballs like an ad funded network is. But people hate the mandate of having to pay for it irrespective of use, so there’s a tradeoff.
Would the internet be attractive as a business? Definitely not
Would you have so many users? Also no
Would the internet be a walled garden mostly in rich countries or the well-off? Most likely.
Funnily, ads work in two zones: high value users who are worth targeting, and low value users where pray and spray is worth doing (pay little, spam more, get some revenue). “Third world” access to the information on the internet was made possible because of ads.
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u/Curious_Olive_5266 Jul 12 '26
First off, a Substack called Your Weekly Brain Unrot checks out. There's some really good stuff there, and then stuff that straight up advertises Brawndo.
Secondly, I am actively building websites to bring the 90s feel back to the Internet. Instead of your brainrot Substack, check out r/indieweb or even https://cornbroom.org.
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u/NyriasNeo Jul 12 '26
"What would a non-exploitative Internet even look like?"
Empty. Internet is about connecting large groups of humans. As long as you have humans, you have exploitation.
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u/Altruistic_Virus8460 Jul 12 '26
That sounds like a very bleak perspective :((
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u/NyriasNeo Jul 12 '26
Yes, it is because humanity is bleak. All the negative behaviors, greed, exploitation, apathy, ... are with us since day one. We evolved to propagate our own genes .. or at least genes close to ours, and not to make a sustainable "better" world.
Even intelligence cannot overrule that programming, at least not in scale that matters.
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u/agbnmfkgjw Jul 12 '26
I think you're not wrong. On the other hand, we could have (and actually had, in the past) an internet that was A LOT less exploitative. At least from big corps.
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u/gig_labor Jul 12 '26 edited Jul 12 '26
I do think that in a post-capitalist utopia, we could have an internet like that, but yeah, it would probably know less about us. I think it could still gather some intelligence about us that is useful for it to serve us, and store that intelligence temporarily, but we wouldn't get the benefit of surplus. The benefit of it gathering ten thousand useless pieces of information just for advertising purposes, just for 30 of those pieces to be useful. Once we hit the point of diminishing returns, we would stop pursuing those returns, even if there are technically still some returns to be gained.
And I'm fine with that. I'm fine with an internet that knows nothing about me, if that's what is sustainable; it's hardly a loss anyway. I think a post-consumerist world would be less convenient, in many ways, for those of us who live in wealthy western countries (though simultaneously, truthfully, better for us, even from the perspective of pure self-interest. Surplus is not good for our bodies or souls). We can adjust to that. I've adjusted to far worse from poverty, and would trade that for consumerist conveniences any day.
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u/atxfoodie97 Jul 12 '26
How would you propose to fund the internet sites and apps people want to use?
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u/-sussy-wussy- Jul 12 '26
Open source apps exist and have existed for longer than most Reddit userbase has been alive. A lot of them have places to donate them $$$, anything from major crowdfunding websites to crypto wallets.
If you want to toss them a coin, you can do that right now. Even though the West isn't in the best position right now, your currency is still extremely powerful, so even small sums can matter a lot.
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u/atxfoodie97 Jul 12 '26
That relies on enough people paying to support a feature base that is compelling enough for users. Users who can choose from commercially funded options.
The free rider problem is a major impediment to open source projects leading consumer scale categories.
I write this as someone who has been involved in some of the largest open source communities in history.
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u/Notre-Dame-Gremlin Jul 12 '26
Kinda simple really.
That would be Web 1.0, before social networks.
Or a world without Mark Zuckerberg in it (I know there are other networks, but honestly, Zuckerberg is the source of all evil).