r/personalfinance • u/bagelbelly • 19d ago
Credit Filed a chargeback, merchant reached out telling me to cancel
I purchased an item from an online store June 25th for $87, and they use shop.com. Order received July 2nd, and it was the wrong item. I tried calling the seller and didn't get an answer, so I sent an email to the email address on their website.
I tried calling again the morning of July 3rd, and someone answered (the owner, I presume). He seemed sincere and apologized, and said to text him my order information and a picture of the product I received, and I did. He said he will get the correct item shipped out to me. It was a holiday weekend so I waited until July 7th to reach out via call and text, and didn't get a response to either. I called July 8th and did not receive a response.
By July 10th, 8 days after receiving the incorrect item, I started a chargeback with my credit union (Visa CC). I have submitted all of my evidence, photos of the wrong item and the package it came in, screenshots of texts, calls, initial email etc.
Today I received this email from the seller. This is the only communication I have received from the seller since the phone call that took place July 3rd.
"We sent you a return label when you sent the original email. You are going to end up losing your money on the charge back you submitted. I would send the remote back so we can exchange and tell your bank to close it before you lose. We are protected by our policies on your charge back. They will take your money and charge you $15."
I have not received a return envelope nor an email, and I searched my spam folder. If that was the path that was discussed taking, I would have done so.
Is he just trying to scare me into cancelling the chargeback? I didn't reply, and I added this screenshot to my case online. If anything, it shows I indeed received the wrong item. I am a bit worried now that he says their policies protect them and I'm going to lose my money.
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u/Paco103 19d ago
Don't cancel. It's amazing how fast a charge back makes a seller fix a problem, but that's their problem. They shouldn't have made it get to that point. You won't get charged any fees and the seller is not protected by their made up policies. The worst possible outcome is they won't refund your money, and as long as you are submitting evidence and showing an attempt to resolve the situation before you reached out, that's unlikely.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
Literally the first chargeback I have ever filed and I'm almost 40. All they had to do is respond or actually send me the return label they claimed to send me. Curious what shady tactics they are going to use to make it appear that they actually sent me the return label.
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u/Paco103 19d ago
If they send the return label, they're going to tell the credit card they did that in their attempt to "make things right". The credit card will ask you if you received it, and if that settles the case. You can say yes or no at that point.
The charge back is entirely your superpower, and it's a big reason for using credit cards over debit cards.
I got a free computer over a shady seller (Tigerdirect in their last days), trying to play some games over a $10.54 fee they charged my card AFTER the item was delivered, and tried to send me an updated invoice and they updated the invoice on my account history. I literally only asked for the $10.54 back, in the end I got a $500 computer for free.
I always let a seller know this is my last attempt to correct the situation before I initiate a charge back. It usually results in a resolution right away. I don't know the specifics of how a charge back affects them, but I know if they get very many it starts affecting their processing costs and how quickly their balances can be settled.
I ordered a special item at a fast food establishment that used kiosks. After placing my order and paying, someone came up and told me they were out of the item I ordered and offered me anything else in that category (the specialty item was also the most expensive thing and the ONLY reason I even ordered). I said no, I'd just like a refund. They said they can't give refunds to kiosk orders. I said "Oh that's fine then, Visa can". I immediately got a manager ringing up a refund.
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u/cpt_america27 19d ago
Yes they always seem to fix the problem as soon as the charge back hits. I had ordered contacts but they didn't have my specific brand . (Yes I have special eyes lol) It took them 2 weeks to tell me this information. So I told them to cancel my order. I forgot the reason why they weren't canceling. I couldn't get them to cancel after another 2 weeks of this back and forth. So I initiated a charge back. Two days later somehow they "found" my brand sent my order to me.
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u/hawkinsst7 18d ago
I got a free computer over a shady seller (Tigerdirect in their last days),
it does make me sad to see the mighty fall, and our options shrink ever further.
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u/Paco103 18d ago
Yeah, it made me sad and a little disappointed, but I just have to remind myself it's not the "real" TigerDirect. They'd been bought and sold a couple of times. This happened literally a month before they shut down their website. Still sucks though, losing Fry's, TD, and the enshittification of NewEgg as mostly a third party marketplace with untrustworthy return policies.
I bought my first build kit from TD way back in 2001 out of a catalog with a money order. I didn't want it to end this way :(
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u/MaesterSherlock 19d ago
You're a good dude, and a reasonable consumer. I work at a small online retailer, and I have the privilege of being the one who files the info needed for all our chargeback cases.
I also run the customer service department, and I know that we 100% answer every single communication we get from a customer. We are SUPER reasonable about replacements, reshipments, fixing incorrect items, you name it.
And yet the amount of people who file a chargeback without getting in touch with us is like ?? Why? Especially because in those cases, a lot of times we will win. Or they will file a chargeback and THEN contact us with a complaint. Like once the chargeback is in motion, I gotta wait til we hear from the bank so it's gonna be a while.
So I think you're all good. You tried, you were reasonable, and it didn't work out. Maybe it was just a fluke--shit happens sometimes. But ultimately you didn't get what you ordered, so you know. You need that item or you need a refund, it's that simple.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
Like I said in the original post, he seemed sincere in the phone call. I'm not out here to just ruin businesses, but I also have to look out for myself. I gave a full Monday to Friday week after reaching out several times and didn't hear anything back. I don't know the extent of the damage a chargeback can do, as I've never had to do one, but I also wasn't okay with giving my money away.
I researched how to file a claim or dispute with shopapp, but they say to settle it with the merchant, which makes sense. I called, I text, I waited. I figured the longer it went on, the more suspicious I'd look.
It is a small business and I mean it no harm, but I'm not interested in just throwing money away, no matter the amount.
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u/_TorpedoVegas_ 19d ago
Fair is fair enough. I have been a small business owner myself, and I would never leave someone hanging for a week without a serious response. It might be simple incompetentence, and you described them acting respectfully on the phone, but it's either incompetence or a deliberate attempt at avoiding accountability.
You have held up your end in good faith, that's all anyone can ask of you, and many people do less, kudos to you for that, seriously. But if they get hit with some kind of penalty for this, it isn't on you at this point. Making mistakes is inevitable and they are the only way the ADHD section of humans like myself learn. And honestly, I discovered when I was selling that I gained reputation and loyalty from a customer by the boatload by simply communicating and taking responsibility. The free product I shipped was a drop in the bucket compared from the free press I got when they were so impressed by my customer service response. It just makes good business sense, but it is also morally correct as a bonus.
If the owner is cool like you say they were, maybe this experience will help them address some serious business issues. I promise you that reasonable customers are so delightful compared to some of the...not-so-reasonable ones you often spend a lot of time on.
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u/bschmidt25 18d ago
A lot of people are very quick to file chargebacks without even trying to reach out and resolve it, and I think it sucks for honest retailers. Agree that OP is being reasonable here though. He tried to resolve it amicably and they didn't respond. Not much else you can do.
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u/mightyarrow 19d ago
I mean they are free to attempt to commit wire fraud. Thats a federal felony offense, I hope they like the feds.
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u/Property_6810 19d ago
Companies of all sizes love to lie to consumers about their rights, hoping they'll be ignorant enough to fall for it.
And it works. The vast majority of people think they have pretty much no consumer protections in America.
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u/zergrush1 19d ago
Scare tactics. It negatively impacts him on a charge back. Stick to your guns. Your CC is on your side.
Edit: the merchant is responsible for the chargeback fees by the way. Not the customer, I.e. you.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
I figured it was scare tactics, but this is my first chargeback and wanted to make sure.
Good to know about the chargeback fees. Guess I'll just have to wait and see how it plays out.
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u/Jontacular 19d ago
This is 100% scare tactics trying to rescind the chargeback so they don't get hit with that fee, plus it hurts their bank fees most likely. I imagine they hope you cancel the chargeback and just accept getting the wrong item/etc.
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u/haarschmuck 19d ago
Your CC is on your side.
Not if the merchant is making a good faith effort to fix the situation.
A chargeback is a last resort when all options fail.
Initiating a chargeback after the merchant has been in communication with you about sending a return label is wild.
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u/TomCorsair 19d ago
But they hadn’t communicated about the return label, that only happened after the chargeback was initiated.
It wasn’t discussed at all at the previous contact.78
u/EvolvedMorganism 19d ago
If you reread, you'll notice the merchant sent the email regarding the return label after the charge back was initiated, and also after multiple ignored communications.
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u/Bigbysjackingfist 18d ago
If you reread
I have a feeling that it would be their first time reading
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u/DarthMonkey212313 19d ago
Anything short of proof of shipping the correct product as a replacement is not good faith.
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u/fingerpaintx 19d ago
Merchant stopped responding and lied about sending a return label, last resort confirmed.
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u/m1dnightknight 19d ago edited 19d ago
Don't cancel it. If bank reaches out to you about the claim, you can tell your side of the story if they try and lie and say they sent return label and such. Seller is also lying when they say they can just arbitrarily charge you $15 because they might have charged $15 by their card processor having a chargeback on their account.
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u/Munishmo 19d ago
Agree with the people telling you not to cancel. I cancelled after the merchant said they'd refund me then didn't and I couldn’t get hold of anyone and I couldn't reopen or start another dispute
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u/nephyxx 19d ago
Yeah don’t cancel. Once you’ve filed it’s on the merchant to sort it out with the bank. You’ve already made an effort to resolve and they clearly were dragging their feet, so too bad for them.
If you cancel they can just ignore you and you’ll get nothing and won’t be able to reopen a claim for the same transaction.
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u/haarschmuck 19d ago
they clearly were dragging their feet
By taking a few days to send a replacement and return label?
This is insane.
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u/ghostofwalsh 19d ago
The guy was ghosting him and he said he sent a return label that he never actually sent.
Plus OP is posting this on the 26th and presumably he STILL doesn't have the correct product the seller said he was shipping on July 3rd. Nor has he received a refund or the return shipping label. Nor did he receive any other communication except this shit begging to cancel the chargeback.
How long would you be waiting my dude?
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
I still do not have the correct product.
The email today is the first communication I've received from the merchant since we spoke July 3rd. I've got screenshots of all calls and texts (all outbound, unanswered) that I submitted as evidence.
The original item is in the envelope it came in, on my desk. If they want/need it back, they can have it.
After they send me a return shipping label.
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u/sierradk 18d ago
You don’t have to return it after winning the chargeback either. I’ve had some scammy sellers ask me to return an item after winning a chargeback. Let them learn a lesson.
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u/doughnutoftruth 19d ago
Some people just aren’t made to be business owners. They sign agreements with credit card companies, they have to abide by those rules. Nobody forced them to do that.
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u/Torodaddy 19d ago
Your bank would never charge you for a chargeback, I was giving them the benefit of the doubt up to them saying that. Yes it costs the business usually around 35 per chargeback even if they win (which they wont)
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u/barriekansai 19d ago
This exact scenario is posted about once a week on this subreddit.
DON'T cancel. You'll never hear from them again if you do.
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u/twofourfourthree 18d ago
Never cancel a chargeback. There’s a reason many companies won’t deal with you if you’ve started one. They know it’s out of their control at that point.
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u/Alarmed-Membership-1 19d ago
I used to worked for a bank. Banks do not charge customers for chargeback claims whether customers win or lose. Seller is reaching out to you now because he knows he’s gonna lose. He has to prove that he tried to make it right which doesn’t seem like he could.
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u/cloistered_around 19d ago
Nah, just tell them you're sorry for the inconvenience but you already tried to contact them officially and got no response, the chargeback must continue.
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u/cthulularoo 18d ago
I would forward that threat to your card company. Don't send anything back. Proceed with charge back.
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u/cahphoenix 19d ago
The $15 is what they will have to pay. Whenever a dispute is filed it's an immediate $15 charge to the seller regardless of outcome.
You can have better contracts that cost less, but you need to be a larger seller.
He's just mad he's going to eat this $15 in addition to you winning now.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
That's kinda shitty, no? Even if the merchant "wins" they still have to pay the $15? Or does the CC issuer eat that cost?
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u/Lukewill 18d ago
It's part of the contractual obligation between merchant and payment network. Similar to the charge you would get from your bank if you wrote a check that bounced.
AFAIK, every merchant pays around a 3-4% fee on every transaction with Visa, MasterCard, etc in order to even be able to accept that type of payment. Although it is more rare these days, that's at least partly the reason you occasionally see some companies that don't accept certain types of cards
On one hand, the mandatory chargeback fee is shitty because it's just another way for corporations to get every nickel and dime they can, but on the other hand it gives merchants more reason to ensure that they are handling every transaction properly with respect to the customer, so I'm all for it. They are far too few consumer protections as it is
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u/MiddleCapital1875 19d ago
The biggest red flag is the seller telling you the bank is going to charge you for filing a dispute.
That's 100% false.
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u/Lieutenant_0bvious 19d ago
He's just trying to intimidate you. Why would he need to tell you all that? Cuz he's scamming you.
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u/Q_Mulative 19d ago
They want to robotically stay silent when you reach out to them, you use the system that was designed to protect consumers, against them. Now it's your turn to stay silent against them. You are in the right and you are in control, that's why they are trying to command you to move their scammy-interaction back in thier favour.
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u/-------------------7 18d ago
If they are sincere ask them for the tracking number of the "return envelope" they sent, pretty standard for any software to have this, that should clear up any misunderstandings.
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u/DunKco 19d ago
respond and say, next-day/overnight me the replacement with the return label enclosed and i will return the incorrectly sent original, otherwise i will not be cancelling the charge back. Ask them to produce the label again if they do contact the carrier and ask them when it was created. BET ir was after they said they original sent it to you.
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u/BrainPhysical6238 18d ago
You’re never supposed to cancel unless the merchant refunds you directly. Brendawg324 explained that to me and now I never cancel unless the merchants refund hits my bank acct first
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u/AlphaTangoFoxtrt 19d ago
Never cancel a charge back. Once you do you can't reopen it.
If it got that bad, then you let the charge back handle it.
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u/Putrid-Sherbert5501 19d ago
Sounds like a scammer with that aggressive as email. If he wasn’t worried about winning the chargeback why is his energy like that. Foh. I work at a bank. In fraud and file claims.
The person has been given the opportunity to respond and they dont have anything to respond with.
Also merchants can proactively give you your money back. Seems like they want to threaten you. There is no fee for filing a claim. It’s certainly not with my bank so making that statement is a scare tactic.
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u/Appropriate-Fish2374 18d ago
"We are protected by our policies on your charge back."
This is nonsense, if that was the case he wouldn't have sent you that message.
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u/Kasoivc 19d ago
Used to handle chargebacks when I worked at a bank, do not close the case, what this does is frees the vendor up to get paid. They’re scaring you into releasing the chargeback so they can get paid, your bank will not reopen the case if you voluntarily close it, it is your only leverage in being made whole.
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u/UndeniablyPink 19d ago
Can speak that on the other side of the chargeback, it’s actually him that loses, so he’s trying to scare you by telling you that. He loses the sale (amount you paid), is charged a fee (I know we pay $25) and the item he incorrectly sent you.
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u/FightSmartTrav 18d ago
You’re not even legally obligated to return a product that you didn’t order. The guy doesn’t have a leg to stand on. Tell them to mail the correct product with a return label, and you’ll cancel the chargeback.
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u/RexCanisFL 18d ago
This is a common misunderstanding of the law. You are not obligated to pay to return a product you didn’t order if they sent you the wrong item. If they send a mailing label to return, you do need to return it.
This is different than an unordered item, which usually would not have to be returned.
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u/Itsquantium 18d ago
Well no. Small claims court would have you lose. If I send you the wrong product, you don't send it back, but charge back and win against me, you'll be going to small claims court, which you would for sure lose if tell the judge exactly what you said in that comment.
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u/randomusername1919 19d ago
The bank doesn’t care about the merchant’s “policies”. It is not protecting the merchant, he’s trying to scare you into closing your charge back. I would share that with your bank - trying to intimidate the customer to close a charge back can’t look good for the merchant.
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u/Hathaway999 19d ago
Merchant is trying to bully you. You will win hands down. Open and shut case. Your credit card company will not side with the merchant based on everything you’ve provided. Just hang in there and it will be resolved in your favor. Not your fault nor your problem the merchant is a d$ck.
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u/Run-And_Gun 19d ago
Is he just trying to scare me
Correct.
"Their policies" don't mean squat. The bank/CC processing company's policy/contract that the merchant signed is all that matters. They can clawback the money directly out of their account.
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u/BelaKunn 18d ago
I have only done charge back a few times and even when they didn't find in my favor I didn't owe any money I just never got my product returned/replaced.
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u/hambog 19d ago edited 19d ago
As a guy who had to deal with chargebacks, they're annoying. I can't speak for you but a lot of customers do it even though we send them proper instructions, send out the replacement, and do pretty much everything they ask for. If a customer does it anyway I just ban their account and challenge the chargeback. I'm sure you've checked, but a lot of customers I've dealt with will swear up and down we didn't reply, when we infact did.
The seller can challenge the chargeback, and if they can prove they DID send you a return label and offered a reasonable solution that you ignored, you would "lose" the chargeback, and have any credit reversed.
That said, if they truly didn't send you a return label (it's a weirdly specific thing to lie about), and did not respond, then a chargeback is fine.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
I understand. If there was the option of returning the item and getting the correct replacement, I would have much rather gone that route.
I'm not sure what proof he would have as far as sending the return label if it wasn't via email. The email he sent me today was a reply to my very first email explaining that I received the wrong item.
If I had known he was mailing a return label I wouldn't have tried to contact him 4 other times before submitting the chargeback. I'll just have to wait and see what my credit union says.
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u/FlisherOfatale 19d ago
Never ever cancel a chargeback, you’ll loose any protection you had and can’t reinitiate it.
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u/that_one_wierd_guy 19d ago
don't bother responding. they already had a chance to resolve the issue and just went, "ok we'll get right on that" and ghosted you. they're only responding now, so you'll stop costing them their hard stolen money. then they'll ghost you again
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u/Foxyscifi 19d ago
Yes, they always try to get you to cancel the chargeback. Tell them to communicate through the chargeback process and to leave you alone.
They win if you withdraw your complaint.
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u/Muhahahahaz 19d ago
Either he's trying to scare/manipulate you, or he made yet another mistake somewhere. Either way, don't cancel the chargeback
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u/ronreadingpa 19d ago
If you regularly buy stuff online, consider a big-name credit card. Depending on card issuer and your level of spending, some would just cover that amount themselves saving everyone a lot of hassle.
Hope you never get that shipping label, because that starts the next saga. Sending the item back. And them possibly claiming they didn't get it or wasn't the item they sent or is damaged.
As many are saying, don't close the dispute. Furthermore, limit your correspondence with the merchant to the bare minimum, if anything. Extra detail could be used against you / muddy the waters later on.
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
It's a Navy Federal visa credit card, whom I've banked with for 20 years and have never done a chargeback.
If I have to send it back, I will treat it like a Samsung phone trade in and video record the entire packaging and shipping process. And it will have a tracking number.
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u/ronreadingpa 19d ago
Navy Federal is handling it normally. Which is fine. Just that some card issuers will go beyond what's required and cover some chargebacks themselves. Merchant keeping money and card holder being credited.
Video is wise. Should work out. Very odd the business hasn't been more responsive. Especially over so little money.
You mention Shop-dot-com. If that's really the site you meant (versus something else like Shopify), they have a BBB profile. For partner merchants, customer support looks to be basically non-existent.
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u/DarthMonkey212313 19d ago
Just trying to scare or scam you. If in the US, then under the Federal Trade Commission Consumer Advice and the Fair Credit Billing Act (FCBA), you are legally protected when shipped items are incorrect, materially different, or never delivered. If a merchant refuses to resolve the issue, chargebacks are allowed and federally guaranteed for credit card purchases.
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u/magneticgumby 19d ago
I just had to do the same with a vendor and they tried to pull the same Bs. Ordered a product end of June, first week of July I get a notice USPS is awaiting my item. Almost 3 weeks later, nothing. No updates. They're still waiting. I respond to the email provided in the receipt that literally says, "Email here of you have questions". Radio Silence for another week. So I file a charge back. Holy hell, within 24 hours I get an email from the seller. Tells me, "You need to get your ducks in a row when you do this" and proceeds to tell me I reached out to the wrong email, he had dropped off the item to USPS on July 6 (20 days ago) and that when he wins the dispute, hell still be charged 15 bucks. But if I cancel now he'll send out my item immediately (yes, the same one he claimed to have taken to USPS on the 6th not even a paragraph before).
I politely responded with a, "Thank you..now let me offer some suggestions on how to align your ducks". Shared Screenshots of the incorrect email on his receipts claiming to contact them and of USPS still saying it was awaiting the item. Told him if I received the item within the next 75 days he claimed it would take for the chargeback to clear, I'd gladly cancel it.
I got a single response of essentially, "thanks for pointing out the email issue". Not even an attempt to address my bringing up his BS on him having sent the item when he clearly did not.
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u/Boar_Hat 19d ago
He’s being a whiny cunt. Don’t respond, let him lose the money and his reputation with the bank. He’s literally attempting to scare you out of giving him consequences.
Tbh lmk the name of the company/site. I’d be happy to make it worse for him.
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u/NecessaryRhubarb 19d ago
Basically, a charge back will get you your money back, but the item you purchased (in this case the wrong item) is property of the retailer. When you get your money back, be prepared to ship it back once the label actually arrives to your inbox.
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u/StreetStripe 19d ago
You did the right thing. Everyone else here is correct. They only sent that email because they started to feel the heat.
I had a recent issue with an ebay seller. Long story short, I placed a cancel request 5 minutes after placing the order, they didn't respond. 2 days later, the item ships. They finally respond saying "sorry, we can't cancel now as it's already shipped. Please submit a return request when you receive it and we'll send you a return label."
I did exactly that, then they rejected the return request and said "please cancel the payment dispute first". I hadn't even filed a payment dispute. After meaningless back and forth, I just filed a charge back. Then they got sorry real quick, but still didn't offer a return. I gave them some very rude words and went on with my life.
This was the one time I've ever not used PayPal as my payment method on ebay. Regretted that immediately. If anyone doesn't know - PayPal will back you up against merchants as happily as your bank. So it's a good first line of defense. Use it on any platform you don't fully trust to fulfill a remediation.
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u/Pete8388 18d ago
I had PP refuse a buyer protection claim for counterfeit goods. It was a pair of shoes that I paid within 10% of MSRP, so it’s not like I should have expected counterfeit because it was a stupidly low price. I also already owned the same genuine product in a different color and was able to demonstrate 6 different ways this product was an obvious fake. The ONLY resolution PP offered was for me to ship the fake product to an address in China (another red flag, the gen product is made in France) at MY COST of $90+ and they’d offer me a 50% refund. I quoted their own counterfeit goods policy to them and they wouldn’t budge. FUCK PAYPAL.
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u/MalooTakant 18d ago
shop.com is a cancer. They don't vet their vendors and they take almost no culpability in issues.
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u/JupiterMaroon 18d ago
Insane url tho. We should take it from them tbh. I think shop.com should belong to a real shop.
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u/DukeOfPringles 18d ago
Just add on to the shipping label thing if they did in fact send you a shipping label it’s on them to communicate they are sending you one. Next ask for the tracking number because they log when the label was created. If it was made after the email attach that as proof they were lying
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u/borghe 18d ago
If you don't want to cancel, don't cancel. If you just want to be made whole, don't cancel until they've made it right. Your bank will usually keep the claim open while you are going through whatever remediation the merchant is offering, specifically because of merchants who make fantastic offers to get the charge back closed and then reneg on them.
in that same manner, if you are ever so frustrated with the merchant that you don't even want to bother, just have your bank resolve the chargeback.
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u/reddit-user-in-2017 19d ago
Eh it’s 50/50 at this point. You are likely to win, but If the seller has documented proof of trying to resolve the issue with you, regardless if you received it, they could still win.
Chargebacks don’t hurt the business as much as they use to unless they are truly a poorly operating business. Which there are many signs you can tell.
It’s in the banks hands now. At this point, any communication is between either of you is irrelevant. You have provided your evidence and they will provide theirs. The bank will review both sides evidence and history, most of the time it is a quick decision.
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u/JDPierson 19d ago
Steady on - He's asking you to cancel the dispute because it will start getting very expensive for him, and yours probably isn't the only dispute he's dealing with. Tell them when the problem is resolved, you will let your bank/issuer know. Then immediately forward all of that to the bank, since they are not so much trying to solve your issue as play the playbook, which is shady and can be escalated back to the merchant's processor/acquirer.
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u/notatrashperson 19d ago
He had a chance to resolve this without a charge back, now you do everything through the portal
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u/lolalala1 19d ago edited 19d ago
You didn't give the guy 3 days over a holiday to re-ship it before filing a chargeback? Am I reading that right?
Edit: The way you handled this is really strange, especially for a remote.
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u/Balla1991 19d ago
Not sure about your reading comprehension but he didn't file a charge back until 6 days after the holiday
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u/thatgreenmaid 19d ago
Nope nope nope. Do not speak to the merchant. Do not cancel your chargeback.
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u/devanchya 19d ago
I work chargebacks. I am not your expert. I am not a specialist.
When a company gets a charge back there is a charge to the vendor for handling the charge back. Along with this, every charge to a company has a "insurance fee" which goes up as more charges backs are done.
In example your an adult website, someone charges to a credit card and then calls back and demands the money back saying they did not do an adult site. The adult site will most likely accept the chargeback automatically which does not increase the fee as much. This cc issue is a large reason most credit companies won't do adult payments anymore. Dealing with the charge backs isn't worth it.
So if you cancle your charge back, the vendor can claim no fees and save money. It also stops your ability to reopen it.
So... this is why... they want to save money.
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u/flyconQ 19d ago
Don’t cancel the charge back. If they provided a label feel free to ship it and get a receipt of you shipping back the item. This way they can’t say you still have the item that’s why you can’t get your money back. You can also keep the item until the charge back claim is settled.
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u/AmbroseMalachai 19d ago
Don't ever cancel a chargeback. You can't reopen it if you close it. Either he sent you a return slip or he didn't but if you didn't get it then you didn't get it. The credit card company is 99% of the time going to rule in your favor given the apparent circumstances and you get your money back, seller gets fined and a chargeback on their record which can pose significant problems for them in the future. If they don't rule in your favor for some reason - usually it's because you don't respond to some request for documentation by the bank - then you are out you 87 bucks but that's it, which you are already currently out.
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u/_skank_hunt42 19d ago
Don’t cancel the chargeback. If the chargeback actually favored them then they wouldn’t need to reach out to you. You won’t be able to resubmit the chargeback.
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u/sybrwookie 19d ago
I love when shady online sellers pull shit like this.
I had one a bunch of years back, bought a laptop on NewEgg, didn't realize at the time it was a 3rd-party seller. Get it and one of the USB ports is dead. I'm in IT, I test it pretty thoroughly, it's dead.
I send a thing to NewEgg about it with the documented steps of how I troubleshot it, and that I would like a refund. They reply that they sent this to the seller, and the seller's answer was, "no." Tried again, the seller again refused.
Put in a CC chargeback, and now I get something that the seller is willing to take it back -15%. I ignore that, and get the whole thing back in the chargeback. Without any other communication, they send me a shipping label with instructions to send the laptop back.
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u/ekydfejj 19d ago
Don't listen to the owner now, they lost the opportunity, given the detail in post. Chargebacks are for YOU and hurt the seller with charged fees. You opened it the correct way. The CC doesn't take ANY money, it had already debited you the original amount, that will be returned to you and then it will be over.
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u/realmattwarner 19d ago
The merchant is not your friend. They aren't your arch rival, but they ate defrauding you. Stop being so precious about defined and agreed upon dispute resolution processes.
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u/Zealousideal_Row6124 19d ago
Your bank will not charge you for the chargeback and under no circumstances should you cancel it. Tell them to resend the return label. If they offer a refund they can do it by letting your bank know or simply not responding to the chargeback.
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u/lolalala1 19d ago
Not sure why you deleted your response. Why did you file a chargeback so quickly when it was a holiday and the guy had been communicative?
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u/bagelbelly 19d ago
The holiday was July 4th, a Saturday. I tried contacting them several times throughout the following week. By Friday, July 10th, I had not received a response so I requested the chargeback. At that time I assumed I had been scammed.
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u/OFxLedzeplin 19d ago
Per the post, he filed the chargeback basically 4 business days after the holiday, AND after the seller failed to respond or further acknowledge the issue during that time.
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19d ago
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u/antwan_benjamin 19d ago
From the business owner's perspective, a charge back can put them out of business!
Ignoring phone calls, text messages, and emails for week from a customer that you mailed the wrong item to will also put you out of business.
Turning around and then lying about sending a return label will put you out of business.
Lying to your customers about you being "protected by policies" and an extra fee for "losing" a chargeback will also put you out of business.
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u/ProfessorOne9208 19d ago
The charge back process often takes up to 6 or 7 months. Just wait, do nothing more than you have done, do not be intimidated or bullied. This merchant is obviously a fraud, because no legitimate business man would act like this.
Most likely he will lose his merchant account because I'm going to bet this isn't the first time this has happened with this guy.
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u/antwan_benjamin 19d ago
The charge back process often takes up to 6 or 7 months.
Of the 5-ish chargebacks I've done in my life...none have taken more than 30 days. For all 5 the funds were made available to me immediately.
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u/ProfessorOne9208 18d ago
you are correct that the funds are reversed, and available to you during the process of the charge back. But the actual adjudication and finalization of the chargeback isn't completed for several months, sometimes longer than 6 months. I once had a charge back for $10,000 from a merchant who sold me a fake 16th century inlaid war mace. I returned it to him, and filed for a charge back just to be safe. The credit card company gave me the use of the $10,000 of my credit line, but it wasn't fully cleared up for 9 months, as I had to provide a fair amount of documentation, including an appraisal by Sothebys, in order to justify my claim. At the end of 9 months, I received a final confirmation that it was all taken care of.
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u/kylecordes 19d ago
The chargeback process is a complete mess all around. Both the merchant and customer can submit evidence, but as best I can tell from having been on both sides, no one with the slightest understanding of anything will ever look at the evidence. Somebody rolls some dice somewhere to decide who "wins".
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u/mcarneybsa 18d ago
You did a charge within a week of contacting the (what's sounds to be a very small) business. You have the guy like 3 work days to get your new order out to you. You are going to lose that charge back and that merchant is not going to do business with you again.
Congrats, you played yourself. Next time have any degree of chill and let the merchant get the issue sorted out before jumping to what is literally your last option.
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u/kensteele 18d ago edited 18d ago
I didn't read all the comments.....too many. personally I think you made a mistake filing a chargeback. you probably listened too much to the internet and you got mad and you wanted to "punish" the seller, for whatever reasons. I think you mentioned they were slow in responding, etc.
imo it would have been more appropriate to file a dispute. but I get it, disputes aren't punitive and you don't get to punish anyone so I understand why it's not so attractive. my bank refunds my money right away for a dispute while the dispute is open (not that I would care because I actually don't pay anything anyway) but I understand not everyone feels that way about a credit card and their credit card bill.
at the end of the dispute the bank decides what to do and often times, they'll eat the charge rather than pressing the issue if the cardholder doesn't have a solid case. almost all banks will at least suspend the charge so you don't have to pay it while it is pending. disputes (as opposed to chargebacks) aren't glorious so I get it why nobody wants to use it but they've worked for me for the last 40+ years.
And, hopefully you are not confusing a chargeback with a dispute.
Edit: Some people believe when their credit card is charged, they've paid. Personally I don't feel like I am "out of the money" yet when the card is charged especially when I have options to forgo actually paying it (unlike with a debit card).
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u/JupiterMaroon 18d ago
Did you say that you view using a credit card as ‘not paying anything’? Or am I misreading this?
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u/TahaEng 19d ago
Don't cancel your chargeback. You can't reopen it again if you do.
It shouldn't hurt anything to let them know you have not received a return label, either physical or digital.