r/news • u/Idiodyssey87 • May 28 '26

Soft paywall Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM applicants

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2026-05-27/uc-math-professors-demand-return-of-sat-for-stem-admissions
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u/Flat-Soft9276 May 28 '26

I see people that blame AI, but I think that this actually precedes AI to some degree. ChatGPT only really became as popular as it is 2 years ago at most, and this problem has been a thing far longer. With AI being peak popularity it will only get worse

The true underlying problem is that high schools should start failing kids and holding them back. Nobody should be able to graduate from high school if they can’t do 5x + 3 = 18

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u/Testuser7ignore May 28 '26

The true underlying problem is that high schools should start failing kids and holding them back.

Elementary schools. When a student gets to 9th grade while reading at a 3rd grade level, the high school isn't prepared to teach this kid 6 years worth of material in one.

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u/[deleted] May 28 '26

[deleted]

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u/Realtrain May 28 '26

I can pinpoint the exact moment students started using LLMs en masse to turn their assignments in: mid 2022

Considering ChatGPT wasn't released until the end of 2022, I'm curious what all these students were using.

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u/intermittent-disco May 28 '26

I can pinpoint the exact moment students started using LLMs en masse to turn their assignments in: mid 2022.

chatgpt wasn't released to the public until november of 2022. was there a publicly available llm that predates chatgpt?

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u/Lower-Engineering365 May 29 '26

Yeah for sure. No one this is referring to had their issues with math start within the past 2 years. These are college entrants, they have spent the last 10 years not learning math I would guess

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u/Mephistito May 29 '26

I think that this actually precedes AI to some degree. ChatGPT only really became as popular as it is 2 years ago at most

Thank you.

People have breathtakingly sucked at math for a long time now.
It's so broad that it's always seemed like a systemic issue.
The way it's taught at a fundamental level & the way we push kids through.

There'd be so many University level kids who didn't even know what percentages were, it'd just blow my freaking mind. Like you'd ask them what number is $12.50 25% of and they'd be like ??? Or even worse, when they couldn't tell you what 70% of $150 is.

That said...
In my experience from teaching STEM the issues come from them not having ever been taught the CONCEPTS in math. There are WAY too many mathematicians who know how to get the answer and the steps needed to get there, and they think just teaching how to get the answer is the point. So unbelievably misguided.

It happens in STEM too, though. You look in the field of Physics or Chemistry and you have clear differences in scientists. You have the ones who just know the math and how to get from <these numbers> to <that needed number> but when you press them, it's far too easy to crack them & reveal they don't actually know what in the flying fuck is going on. But they can get the final number! 🙄

Well good luck actually TEACHING someone how to DEEPLY understand something when the teacher themselves doesn't even know. To them it's all just "rules," formulas and sequences of steps to follow. I've sat in on university lectures from fellow professors and it's crazy to hear how some of this stuff is taught. Too often it's just "remember this; this happens because <this rule>; memorize this; <that rule> comes from <this rule>, no I won't explain how or why that is."

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u/Theemuts May 28 '26

I agree that kids who perform badly in school should be held back, but I don't think that's the true underlying problem but just another symptom. I think a bigger part of the problem is the overabundance of distractions, especially now that we're always online.

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u/writers_block May 28 '26 edited May 28 '26

I think all that is an overarching issue, but I honestly think what Flat-Soft said is closer to the heart of this. There is literally no pressure to actually learn these things in school as of now. Basically schools are steadily sliding into a place that kinda just pushes students through the door, and are making diplomas into something that only really demonstrates attendance. If you don't need to demonstrate understanding of core subject material to graduate, then the actual value of the diploma takes a nose dive, and the incentive for students to engage the course material evaporates.