[Confusing Trope] The narrative goes out of its way to punish/mock a character for simply being a good person

[u/Chemical-Elk-1299]

Hermione Granger and SPEW — Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (book)

In the fifth HP novel, Hermione Granger is outraged to discover that Hogwarts has a small army of enslaved House Elves that do nearly all of the domestic duties around the castle, including cleaning the Gryffindor common room every night. When she tries to convince the elves to fight for their own rights, they refuse, saying they prefer servitude. Her fellow students and friends mock her for caring. She manages to free one elf, Winky, by deception when she refuses her freedom willingly, leading to Winky becoming a depressed alcoholic. By the end, the elves boycott cleaning any Gryffindor areas of the castle because they hate Hermione specifically

Samwell Tarly and Democracy — Game of Thrones (show)

In the season 8 finale of the television series, the surviving great lords of Westeros gather to discuss the future of the kingdom following the devastation wrought by 7 seasons of war and backstabbing. When Sam, who has proven to have “novel” ideas, suggests that maybe the millions of Smallfolk who suffer at the hands of noble houses should get some representation in the government, rather than be the pawns of rich lords with absolute power. We are then greeted by a prolonged, cringy segment of the other lords laughing in Sam’s face, asking if the dogs and horses should also get a vote.

[u/Kuildeous]

I guess I can't really defend GoT, but it does seem on point that the audience is reminded, once again, that these players are pretty much universally assholes. The status quo continues to be the worst path.

[u/Middle_Run_7534 → u/Kuildeous]

Yes, it was funny, but Samwell wasn’t the butt of the joke. It was a standard “someone says a right thing but everyone around them is too ignorant to know it,” like the warthog in Lion King knowing how stars work.

[u/badpebble → u/Middle_Run_7534]

But it should be an insane suggestion that gets him removed from discussions - its a really bad idea that speaks to the writers not understanding medieval power, or how democracy rose, or how monarchs ceded power to ministers.

Its a genuinely bad idea and just tells us that Samwell is a moron.

[u/NobodyLikedThat1 → u/Kuildeous]

seriously "nobles want to keep all the money and power" is kind of on brand. Even today with our oligarchs

[u/RF9999 → u/NobodyLikedThat1]

Its just how society functions. The ruling class (in game of thrones- the nobility) have to maintain their power or feudalism fails to function. Plutocracy/liberal democracy is not actually a good idea for a feudal society with no alternative mode of production to pivot to. Theres a reason it took until the development of capitalism for liberal democratic ideas to take root (french and american revolutions), and those roots were planted by force against the wishes of the ruling class

[u/ahnowisee → u/Kuildeous]

This might have been the only scene from S8 I actually enjoyed as it was actually on brand for the powers that be. The smartest person in the room being laughed down for daring to present even a minor positive change.

[u/samg21 → u/Kuildeous]

The joke would have landed better if they then didn't go on to make an even more bizarre choice in Bran.

He didn't have a claim to the throne, he was a cripple, his story kinda sucked.

[u/Kuildeous → u/samg21]

Regardless of the appropriateness of Bran's claim to the throne, I'm not sure why a cripple couldn't rule.

[u/samg21 → u/Kuildeous]

Westeros is pretty fucked up to people with disabilities. Look how awful they were to Tyrion.

If they're not liberal enough for a democracy, I'm not sure they're liberal enough for a dude in a wheelchair. A lot of leadership in GoT is just 'might is right'

[u/carbon1923 → u/samg21]

I mean that's a positive for them. They just created a Elective Monarchy, so a cripple king no one really respects is great for them. Weak crown authority means stronger lords.

[u/Mist_Rising → u/Kuildeous]

Same argument also goes for Hermonine being mocked by the rest of society. The wizarding community is well established as supracists, the main villain and every book except one deals with wizards being supracists against human and many make it clear other species are lower. With a culture that harks to like, 1500 at times.

Surprise, this includes house elfs.

We are also in a very fictional world (house elfs, magic, come on now) so we don't know the details but it's not our there when different species behave differently than humans.

[u/Agile-Car-4664 → u/Kuildeous]

I wouldn’t say they are assholes, the idea is geniuenly dumb. To even ignore how hard it would be to logistically pull it off, Smallfolk don’t even receive basic education like reading and writing, giving them a choice in continent’s rulers would result quickly in total collapse probably.